DEBBIE ELLIOTT, host: 'Baa, Baa Black Sheep' is actually a protest against taxation. And 'Sing a Song of Sixpence'?

It's about King Henry VIII and his break from the Catholic Church. London librarian Chris Roberts was moonlighting as a walking tour guide when he discovered that nursery rhymes had juicy histories. Now he's compiled those tales into a book. It's called 'Heavy Words Lightly Thrown: The Reason Behind the Rhyme.' He joins me now from our London bureau.

Jun 25, 2009. [Archive] Bibilical Planet Nibiru in 12/21/12 No Topic Forum. I'm sure we've all seen unidentified flying objects, but that doesn't mean they contain little green men. If you can't, or more likely won't, explain the blatant attempt at such a moronic HOAX, you might as well kiss your credibility goodbye. What does 'blatant' mean? Thumb blatant. Xantares is blatant. Global Warming Is A blatant LIE & This video scientifically Proves it. The Most Blatant Cheater EVER (CS:GO Overwatch #13). Blatant combos ft: Good Players. BLATANT HACKING IN CS:GO!! Thumb 12th Planet - Be Blatant.

Welcome, Chris. CHRIS ROBERTS (Author, 'The Reason Behind the Rhyme'): Thank you. ELLIOTT: I want to read the first line from the introduction in your book. Here it is.: `It should come as no surprise that nursery rhymes are full of sex, death and cruelty.'

Now, really, that does come as somewhat of a surprise to me. ROBERTS: I'll pick an obvious one.

`Ding-dong bell, pussy in the well. Who put her in? Little Johnny Flynn.' It's quite clearly the tale of a little boy putting a cat in a well. And as we all know, cats can't swim. Some are more blatantly cruel, and others are more coded in their meanings.

It's to do with words in English changing the meaning over time. It's to do with changing assumptions of what we think of as childhood. Childhood is a relatively recent phenomena, certainly over the last couple of hundred years, that children are seen as very separate from adults. So there would be no reason in the past not to have what would now be considered adult themes in rhymes that children could hear and sing. ELLIOTT: Well, let's get to a little sex and debauchery from your book, 'Goosey Goosey Gander.' Why don't you recite that for us first? ROBERTS: `Goosey Goosey Gander, where shall I wander?

Upstairs and downstairs and in my lady's chamber. There I met an old man who wouldn't say his prayers, so I took him by the left leg and threw him down the stairs.' Where do I begin with this? A key--this is a very good example of a word that has changed its meaning over the centuries.

Now in the 16th, 17th and possibly into the 18th century in England, the word `goose' meant prostitute. The phrase `to be bitten by a goose' meant to contact a venereal disease from the working girls. And this rhyme's quite interesting. There's a number of theories about this rhyme. One is that it ties into Henry VIII and his taking land from the Catholic Church. There were two prongs to Henry's attack. One was he took the land; the other was a propaganda offensive, and this rhyme becomes part of that.

The rhyme associates the Catholic Church with prostitution, and this is reinforced slightly more in the second verse, where you have `There I met an old man who wouldn't say his prayers, took him by the left leg, threw him down the stairs.' The not saying the prayers bit is relating to the new English Prayer Book--that was a Protestant Prayer Book--and the left leg is--I don't know if this works in America, actually, but in England, left leg or left-footer is a term for Catholic. And so there you have the rhyme linking the Catholic Church to immoral acts. Software Simulazione Test Medicina 2014.

ELLIOTT: So from sex and religion to taxes why don't we go? ROBERTS: Why don't we? ELLIOTT: We talked a little bit at the beginning of our conversation about 'Baa, Baa Black Sheep.'

I'm going to recite this one: `Baa, baa black sheep, have you any wool? Yes, sir, three bags full. One for the master and one for the dame and one for the little boy who lives down the lane.'

I guess I can see that this would have something to do with paying taxes, but not really. (Soundbite of laughter) Mr. ROBERTS: This is quite an old rhyme, actually; this goes back to the 12th century at least. And the wealth of England was very much based on wool. The lord chancellor still sits on a wool sack in the House of Commons to remind everyone about that. And 'Baa, Baa Black Sheep' was a lament from the farmers of England who in the rhyme are represented by the little boy. The other two figures in the rhyme, the master and the dame, are--the master is the king or the king's representatives; the local nobility would collect revenue on behalf of the king--and the dame is the church.

So you have these very punitive tax rates of 66 percent; a third to the church, third to the church and a third left for the poor little farmer. That's the basis of the rhyme. It's an early example of no taxation without representation, I believe. ELLIOTT: Next, can you read us 'Sing a Song of Sixpence'? ROBERTS: `Sing a song of sixpence, a pocketful of rye, four and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie. When the pie was opened, the birds began to sing. Now wasn't that a dainty dish to set before a king?

The king was in his counting house counting out his money; the queen was in the parlor eating bread and honey. The maid was in the garden hanging out the clothes when along came a blackbird and it nipped off her nose.' Now potentially--certainly the first part, is just a description of a meal, about baking, baking birds in a pie and the whistling of the steam when the pie is cooked. The other theory--again, it's relating to Henry VIII. ELLIOTT: Again?

ROBERTS.more specifically--I know, again. There seems to be a golden age of nursery rhymes in Britain where they--from basically Henry VIII's time, which is 16th century, to the Tudor monarchs to the end of the Stuarts, which is a couple of years later. And it was a time when England was sorting itself out religiously. It was a time of religious wars, it was a time of great divisions in society.

We had our own civil war during that period. And a lot of the rhymes seem to come from that time. It seems to be a great flowering for English folk song. But the theory with the counting house bit is that the maid is Ann Boleyn, who's Henry's second wife, and that the queen is his first wife, Catherine of Aragon. And it's telling the story--the first queen is off in the parlor, kind of out of the action and that the second queen, who Henry divorced and then executed, has her nose snipped off by the blackbirds, which here apparently represent the church. ROBERTS: Well, Chris Roberts, we'll be coming back to you in the coming weeks for some more reasons behind the rhymes.

Chris Roberts is the author of 'Heavy Words Lightly Thrown.' He's also a librarian at Lambeth College in south London and the proprietor of F and M Walking Tours. ROBERTS: Thank you very much. ELLIOTT: If you'd like to offer your comments, in rhyme or prose, go to our Web site, npr.org, and click on `Contact us,' select WEEKEND ALL THINGS CONSIDERED and send us your thoughts. Please tell us where you live, include a phone number and tell us how to pronounce your name. Copyright © 2005 NPR. All rights reserved.

Visit our website and pages at for further information. NPR transcripts are created on a rush deadline by, an NPR contractor, and produced using a proprietary transcription process developed with NPR. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.

Army National Guard Specialist Joseph Couch Specialty: Aviation Operations Dates of Service: 2013 - present There is no afterlife; this life is all we have. While some may think this is reason never to endanger oneself in the military I believe they are wrong. I enlisted to help people so that they can live their lives. Whether I help by rebuilding after a tornado, assisting pilots on a safe mission, or someday helping negotiate peace, it's always better to work for something than to pray for it.

Air Force Major Chris Lehto Specialty: F16 pilot Dates of Service: 2000-present Decorations: 2 air medals, all others standard (2xmeritorious service, commendation, korea defense etc.) Tours of duty: Balad, Iraq 09/20 I applaud the ground fighters. They should do whatever they need to do for their difficult jobs.

Especially the guys and girls standing in US uniforms in broad daylight in combat zones. If they need prayer and chaplains to help them so be it. But if it was me I wouldn't ask for it because I am an atheist and can't bring myself to believe in a christian god.

I also don't believe in unicorns, santa claus (gasp), and the 4,200 other religions on this planet. But I am tired of bowing my head in prayer at every dinner function, change of command ceremony, and military function. A class graduates (most of them do by the way) and I have to bow my head and thank the lord for giving them the strength to get through this tough course. Of course if something did happen and someone did die then I would also have to bow my head in prayer for them not getting through the course? I don't get it, but fine you can believe whatever imaginary thing you want. I believe a founding principle of this country is freedom from religious persecution. The first sentence of the First amendment says 'United States Constitution prohibits the making of any law respecting an establishment of religion.'

And yet because I am a military member and have to attend military functions I have to listen to religious invocation after invocation. I have great respect for the young men and women who have openly said they are atheists. I had 'atheist' as my religion on my military records and then changed it. I was up for promotion and thought 'atheist' would skew judgement. I only wish I had more courage to come out earlier and be more vocal like you guys. There is not a single open atheist in congress of any level of government (state and above). There is not a single secular chaplain.

And yet over 20% of the general population, and of the military, claim no religious affiliation. I urge you to stand up for your beliefs and make it known that we exist, and that we are dedicated to making a positive influence on this world through moral and right acts, based on reasoning and human compassion, not ancient archaic beliefs. And yes we are in the military.

Air Force Senior Airman Christopher Aviles Specialty: Security Forces Dates of Service: June 2011-Present Decorations: AF Outstanding Unit Award (2/devices),AF Good Conduct Medal,National Defense Service Medal,Global War On Terrorism Expeditionary Medal,Global War on Terrorism Service Medal,Humanitarian Service Medal,Air Force Expeditionary Service Ribbon with Gold Border,AF Longevity Service,AF Training Ribbon Tours of duty: Operation Enduring Freedom, Al Dhafra AB 2013 Growing up I was told I was a Catholic, but was never taught the Bible or knew what was being said in Church. I have always followed my own secular belief which involved science (which includes peer reviewed empirical evidence), logic, reason, and humanitarianism. I came out as an Atheist when I was deployed and took the time to research and inform myself of the questions I had about the world. I realized simply, that my way of life, was shared by others called atheist/humanist. The quickest path to confirming my atheism was simply reading the Bible and the horrible things their God invokes.

Ever since then the realization of the majority of Christians, along with other religions, are living their lives based on a book they have never read shook me. The idea of faith, which is belief without evidence or good reason, has always been a revolting notion.

And I have been doing my part in freeing minds by education ever since. I'm good without any gods, and will continue to serve proudly in every aspect. Army Major Keira Brennan Specialty: Civil Affairs/Chemical Corps Dates of Service: 10/1987 - 2/2012 Decorations: Bronze Star, Joint Service Commendation, ARCOM, AAM, Humanitarian Service Medal, Kosovo Campaign Medal, Afghanistan Campaign, NATO Campaign Medal, Basic Parachutist Badge, USAF Space Operations Badge Tours of duty: SOCEUR 2009-2010, ISAF 2007-2008, KFOR 2001-2002 My journey from a theistic life started in 2005. I had been in the closet my entire life and coming to grips with my identity (Bisexual female married to a woman) meant exploring what life looked like not having to feel 'shamed' or being bad because of some invisible divine mandate. The sham of religion and contempt of the military Chaplaincy started in 2007 while on a tour in Afghanistan where a co-located unit's Bn Chaplain showed how contemptible Christians can to both a unit, a civilian population and mission. Further unraveling of my belief came in a 2010 visit to Egypt where I saw just how much Christian liturgies and ancient religions are basically the same --and all arguments to the contrary fail. As a retiree I want to support the younger generation of service members and recapture what Madison said about religion.

'Strongly guarded as is the separation between religion and & Government in the Constitution of the United States the danger of encroachment by Ecclesiastical Bodies, may be illustrated by precedents already furnished in their short history.' (Detached Memoranda, circa 1820). Marine 1st Lieutenant Matthew Lindauer Point of Contact Specialty: Manpower Officer Dates of Service: Dec 2006 - Present Tours of duty: Jul 2007 - Jan 2008 Marine Air Support Squadron 1, Camp Pendleton; Jan 2008 - Jan 2009 Marine Air Control Group 38 (Forward), Al Asad; Jan 2009 - Jul 2009 Marine Air Support Squadron 1, Camp Pendleton; Jul 2009 - Jul 2012 NROTC, Ohio State University; Jul 2012 - May 2013 The Basic School, Quantico; May 2013 - Present Marine Air Control Group 28, Cherry Point. Military is built upon mission type orders. They shape every decision service members make, whether it be which uniform to wear to which patrol route to take.

We should hope that those orders are based upon humanity's best understanding of reality and not upon ancient myths or the unverifiable faith of religious individuals. As an atheist service member, I aim to claim my defense of reason and convince others to follow the likes of MAAF. Air Force Staff Sergeant Chris Jones Specialty: Russian Linguist Dates of Service: 2009-Current Decorations: Joint Service Commendation Medal, Air Force Outstanding Unit Award (2) I was raised going to church fairly regularly. It took me until around high-school to realize that I didn't believe in most of what was being said there. While I think that there are some good teachings about being decent to each other, concepts like heaven, hell, and some sort of god had lost traction with me. The book that I credit in helping me reach this conclusion was Lamb: The Gospel According to Biff, Christ's Childhood Pal by Christopher Moore.

It took until I met a friend in the military who introduced me to modern Atheism. I understood that that's what I am. I don't believe in religion so why hide it any more?

Those who truly care for me will support me. And I am lucky to have been supported by my wife and parents in my realization. Marine Lance Corporal Francisco Irizarry Gutierrez Specialty: Infantry Dates of Service: Sep 2005-Jan 2011 Decorations: Purple heart, Combat action Ribbon ( 2nd Iraq 2006-2007, Iraq 2008, Afghanistan 2009) My atheism began as anger towards the catholic god. The questions I had were never really answered. The answers were inadequate and preposterous. I continued to ask questions and science provided an answer. Anger turned into curiosity which in turn turned into atheism.

Raised in a catholic Hispanic family, well you could imagine what it was like to come out as an atheist. The more I discover about science, the more passionate I become.

Army Staff Sergeant Grace Greer Specialty: Drill Sergeant Dates of Service: July 2002 - present Decorations: Army Achievement Medal 2, Army Good Conduct Medal 3, National Defense Service Medal, Korean Defense Service Medal, Iraq Campaign Star 2, Global War on Terrorism Service Medal, Humanitarian Service Medal, Armed Forces Service Medal, NCO Professional Development Ribbon 3, Army Service Ribbon, Overseas Service Ribbon 3, Drill Sergeant Identification Badge Tours of duty: Iraq Dec 2007-March 2009, Haiti Jan 2010-June 2010 My journey as a Foxhole Atheist has not been an easy one. I didn't always even identify myself as an Atheist because I didn't want to be bombarded with the word of god nor was I prepared to explain it.

I had a profound moment in WLC when the welfare of my 1059 (graduation certificate) was held over my head during a graduation practice. We were going over all of the key movements we would make in unison, stand up, sit down, let us pray. I stayed at the position of attention, it caused the SGLs to question me and then insist that I crossed my arms in front of me and bowed my head just for 'uniformity purposes'. Being young, uneducated and not fully prepared to defend my case I caved in for graduation practice.

For the actual ceremony I stood tall and did not bow my head. I rightfully completed the course and earned that 1059. Now, I am at Joint Base Lewis McChord and looking to create an alternative to the frequent prayer breakfasts and chaplain activities.

I would like to find other Foxhole Atheists to assist in the mentoring and education of the future leaders of our military. (excerpts taken from Featured Foxhole Atheist site (see 'personal site' link above). Army National Guard Specialist Tyshon Bullock Specialty: Calvary Scout Dates of Service: May 19th, 2008 - current Tours of duty: Operation Enduring Freedom 12-13 As a cultural anthropology major, I found a passion in studying the cultural differences we as a people have on Earth. More specifically, I am interested in the study of beliefs, values, and norms of a culture or group of people. In my experience, without naming any certain command, the Army caters to Christian ideologies. Chapels, holiday parties, ceremonies, for example, all have a christian tone quietly or loudly in the background.

I found myself, as a nonbeliever, sticking up for soldiers of other faiths, when their voices went unheard. From pork substitutes at chow to time off for 'spirit' walks. Even though I am not a believer of any religious creed, I still fight for equality of all instead of favoritism of one. Glad to find a hub of like-minded people here. Navy Lieutenant Ryan Andrews Specialty: Surface Warfare Dates of Service: 1999-2005, 2009-Present Decorations: Navy/Marine Corps Achievement Medal (3 awards), Good Conduct Medal Tours of duty: USS FITZGERALD (DDG 62) 2001-2005, USS DECATUR (DDG 73) 2009-2012, COMDESRON 40 2012-Present I have no issues or complaints with people praying or practicing religion, be it peacetime or wartime.

I have noticed lots of abrasiveness when simply not participating, or answering honestly when asked about god. So I joined this site to prove that you can be a good person with good morals without a religious aspect, and to let others know that they're not alone. I don't seek out conflict with people of faith, but I won't shy away from it either. Air Force Major Nathan Van De Veer Specialty: E-4B Navigator Dates of Service: Feb 2003 to the present Decorations: Air Medal (7), AF Commendation Medal (3), AF Achievement Medal, Afghanistan Campaign Medal (2), Iraq Campaign Medal (2), Global War On Terrorism Expeditionary Medal, Global War On Terrorism Service Medal, AF Expeditionary Service Ribbon w/Gold Border (4) Tours of duty: May-Jul 05 Bagram (OEF), Mar-Jun 06 Ali Al Salem AB (ISO OIF), Jul-Nov 07 Bagram (OEF), Dec 09-Mar 10 Al Udeid AB (ISO OIF/OEF), Jul-Oct 10 Al Udeid AB (ISO OND/OEF), Dec 11-Feb 12 Korea.

Army Sergeant 1st Class Andrew Smith Specialty: Combat Photographer (MOS 25V) Dates of Service: 1995- present Decorations: Joint Service Commendation x2, Combat Action Badge, Paratrooper Tours of duty: Albania (1999), Kosovo 2001-2002), Djibouti ISO OEF (2002-2003), Afghanistan OEF (2009-2010) I am a strong advocate for the secular interpretation of our First Amendment. I am not interested in trying to persuade folks to forsake their religious beliefs. I only desire a 'level playing field' within our military when it comes to religion. I believe that our military is currently doing it wrong regarding its obligation to respect its service members' religious and non-religious beliefs equally.

I am frustrated by too many of our service member's unwillingness to acknowledge the difference between individual religious rights and the establishment or preference of a religion on behalf of our military (read: government). While I think that prayer and religion are silly, I am not upset by prayer in combat or anyone's right to exercise their religious beliefs LEGALLY. I am an atheist no matter where I am, and I am grateful for the opportunity to network and advocate with other like-minded folks here. Army Specialist Christian Gorke Specialty: Infantry Dates of Service: March 2009-present Decorations: parachutist badge, expert infantry badge Tours of duty: Haiti (p-au-p) Jan-Apr 2010; Iraq (Taji, khalid, Al asad) May-Dec 2011 As for my thoughts on prayer in combat, people seem to live under the false impression that all atheists fear death and therefore in combat there is a need for religion or God(s) that can assist you in those desperate times so you can gather the courage necessary to get up and react. I actually find this counter-intuitive, to my own experience at the very least, when I was stabbed in a riot my immediate thoughts weren't 'oh god I'm getting stabbed, I immediately regret not believing and I sure do hope there's a cushy afterlife waiting for me,' nor were my thoughts 'oh I need to react,' I simply fought back with literally nothing on my mind. Looking back it would be cool to say my life flashed before my eyes during my bleeding and I contemplated my life decisions, but that would be false, it was primal reaction mixed with adrenaline.

When I'm getting shot at, I take cover and fire back to get fire superiority. My focus is on the fight. As for the fear of death, that could not be farther from the truth. I embrace my mortality. As Richard Dawkins eloquently put, 'We are going to die, and that makes us the lucky ones.'

Death may be an everlasting blackness waiting, but my focus is and always has been gratefulness for being a part of this crazy show that is life. If I die in combat or in my sleep, I'd have died knowing I was immensely gifted to be here and to share this world with my daughter. Army Major David Schrier Specialty: Physician Dates of Service: June 2003 - October 2009 Tours of duty: 28th Combat Support Hospital, Baghdad, August 2006 - February 2007 I spent six months in a combat support hospital. We took care of wounded civilians, insurgents, and military. Our hospital was mortared regularly, and praying about random explosions just seemed ridiculous. The individual people in the unit were mostly accepting of, or apathetic about, my atheism. However, there was a lot of overt religious emphasis from the unit command.

The hospital chaplain, in particular, was naive to the concepts of religious diversity and freedom. He turned several mandatory 'briefings' into a platform for proselytizing and preaching. He even tried to convert or preach to wounded patients, including locals and their families; these attempts were sadly comical, as they were overwhelmingly Muslim and almost never spoke English. My time in the Army, and in Iraq, served to cement my convictions about the folly of using religious dogma as guidance for personal policy and actions, and the high chance that religious doctrines can be volatile when placed in opposition to each other. Marine Sergeant Adam Dunigan Specialty: Avionics Dates of Service: Apr 1, 2008 - present Decorations: Naval Commendation Medal, Good Conduct Medal, others Tours of duty: Pacific Fleet UDP 2009-2010, OEF Afghanistan 2010-2011 I think the most egregious offense that religion perpetrates in the military is that it asserts itself (and is thus treated) as an integral part of military life.

When I first entered basic training and we were given time off contingent on attending religious service, I was shocked. By allowing religious organizations to insert themselves into military life (i.e. Deployment, bootcamp, etc.), the government is opening vulnerable youth to coercive faith practices. I want the men and women around me to know there is another choice. Army Sergeant Kevin Dare Specialty: Medic Dates of Service: 28 Mar 2007 to present Decorations: Army Commendation Medal with 1 Oak Leaf Cluster, Army Achievement Medal, Army Good Conduct Medal, Combat Medic Badge Tours of duty: Iraq, Dec 2007 to Feb 2009 and Jul 2010 to Jun 2011 I do remember when my recruiter asked me which religion I was and I strongly emphasized 'NONE!!'

And I ended up with 'no pref recorded'. At the time I didn't know any better. The only thing I've ever encountered when I told people that I was Agnostic or had no religion was when a fellow medic, a devout Jew, asked if I worshipped Satan. I only replied with, 'I just told you I don't worship any gods, so why would I worship that one?' I've never been called out for not bowing my head during any invocation during any official ceremony. The only time I've felt uncomfortable was when I reenlisted in '10, and I didn't tell my physician's assistant, whom I choose as my reenlistment officer, that I didn't want to 'swear', so I'm sure everyone noticed me choking on the religious words.

I fortunately haven't felt much descrimination for my lack of belief. When asked if I believe in a god, I say, 'I don't know,' which is the Agnostic, 'and, I don't care' which is all me. I don't need a religion or a god for me to be a decent person. Navy Petty Officer 2nd Class John Yockachonis Specialty: Aviation Safety Equipment Dates of Service: May 1986 - May 1990 Decorations: Good Conduct Medal Tours of duty: VR-60 Squadron, 1987 - 1990 I had no problems with religion being pushed on me, excepting boot camp, where church attendance was compulsory.

I was not openly atheist, and did not identify as atheist until years later, but I did not believe. It was something we never talked about, and I didn't give it much thought, but I thought of heaven, hell and god as ridiculous constructs of men, not to be taken seriously. Marine Sergeant Steve Dixon Specialty: Aviation Electrician Dates of Service: 1975 - 1979 Decorations: Good Conduct Medal Tours of duty: June 1975 - June 1979, VMFA-251 I do not recall being forced to attend any kind of religious service (except in boot camp, but that ceased nearer to graduation), we were pretty much left alone. As for dog tags, I seem to recall a no preference choice, but cannot remember. My dog tags have long since disappeared in the numerous job related moves our family has made over the years, so cannot confirm. Why a religious choice is necessary for a dog tag is beyond me. Should it come to it, the family can take of any religious matters, if any.

Navy Reserve Petty Officer 3rd Class William Chambers Specialty: Mechanic Dates of Service: 2007 - present Tours of duty: 2008 - 2009 Iraq I haven't had a big problem with this really. I wasn't yet open about my beliefs or certain yet at that point in time. It has not been a quick process. You know undoing 30 years of upbringing and life experience, but I believe it is right. And about prayer in combat?

Whatever keeps you sane. I might utter some words if i were scared to death or something, I dunno I might not.

You would certainly be able to think more clearly in a critical situation though if you didn't have to think about what time it was and whether you missed your prayer. Whether you slipped up and said a curse word you could use all your mental effort to find a way to complete your mission and/or survive the situation. Sometimes that little bit helps. It also doesn't help if you are blinded by thinking that god is going to miraculously abracadabra your butt out of a bind either. Because it will not happen.

You will die. I will say this though about religious tolerance, the first friend I made after bootcamp was a girl who was born and raised muslim and still is muslim. Her husband is an active duty marine. I later deployed with her and went to 'A' school (job training) with her as well. She is a great friend. Some people might think.' Oh no a muslim'.

But they would be ignorant. Army Major Domingos Robinson Specialty: Army Band Officer Dates of Service: August 1998 - Present I've been an agnostic most of my life and an atheist for almost half my life. I've never encountered any problems being an atheist in the military, and even have a good friend who is a chaplain (and he knows I'm an atheist). But, the overt religiousness of the military does get old sometimes. The strangest thing was having a chaplain provide support to my change of command ceremonies, knowing that not only did the other people participating in the ceremony expect a chaplain, so did everyone attending.

I wonder how it looked for me to stand up there with my head high, eyes forward during the invocation. Air Force Airman 1st Class Patrick Madden Specialty: Fuels Distribution Dates of Service: 15 May 2009 - Present Decorations: Air Force Overseas Ribbon Short, Global War on Terrorism Expiditionary Medal, Air Force Expeditionary Service Ribbon Tours of duty: Ali Al Salem Kuwait Operation New Dawn Jun 2010, Aviano Italy Operation Odyssey Dawn May 2010-Mar 2011 I do not believe in a god and I have served my country without a god. I won't fall to my knees and pray in combat when I could do something more productive with my time like reload, use the radio, or perform Buddy Care. I think if people want to pray in the Military then they should do it at the Chapel or in their home with their family. Air Force Captain Madison Scaccia Point of Contact Specialty: Logistics Dates of Service: Aug 2011 - present I used to be afraid of my atheism. As a child, I tried so hard to believe.

I did the youth groups, the Bible study, all of that. It never clicked.

It never made sense to me. Everyone tells you to work hard and to push yourself, but then, at the end of it, you're supposed to thank god? In high school, I asked myself: honestly, do I believe this stuff? When I realized the answer was a resounding 'no', I finally decided enough was enough, and that I wasn't going to buy into it anymore. I'm fine with religion for the most part. If someone wants to live their life based on a theistic doctrine, that's fine by me. What really gets me is the fact that every military event I attend begins with an 'invocation', meaning 'prayer'.

I was given the opportunity to give an invocation at an ROTC event a few years ago, and not once did I reference a god. It IS possible to remind your fellow service members to think about their deployed buddies, to keep their families in your thoughts, to remember the ones you lost without going through a deity first. I do admit that this specific tradition is part of the military culture, and not something I want to speak out against at the risk of putting personal beliefs before the mission. However, when it all hits the fan, I'll be depending on the airman next to me, not god. If you've got my back, I don't really care WHAT you believe. My dog tags say 'Atheist' and it's not something I'm PROUD of; it just IS.

Army National Guard Sergeant 1st Class Casey Braden Specialty: Chemical/Biological/Nuclear Dates of Service: June 1999 - Present Decorations: Army Commendation Medal (x3), Army Achievement Medal (x3), Army Reserve Components Achievement Medal (x3), National Defense Service Medal, Global War on Terrorism Expeditionary Medal, Armed Forces Reserve Medal with M Device Tours of duty: Operation Noble Eagle October 2003-June 2005, Operation Enduring Freedom July 2011-2012 I recently had someone learn that I was an atheist and say, 'But you are one of the nicest, happiest people I know! That doesn't make any sense!' I aim to change people's opinions about what it means to be an atheist, and to show that you don't need belief in some supernatural being to be a good person. I also think that the military needs to realize that not everyone in their ranks is a Christian, and that Chaplain-led Christian prayers in formation are grossly inappropriate. It seems that our Chaplain believes that if he prefaces every prayer with 'I invite you to pray in your faith tradition as I pray in mine,' it makes it all okay.

Air Force Tech Sergeant Kenneth Labelle Lay Leader Specialty: Chinese Linguist Dates of Service: 2 Jan 2002 - Present Decorations: Joint Commendation Medal (one oak leaf cluster), Air Force Achievement Medal, Army Achievement Medal Tours of duty: Jan 2002 - Feb 2002, Basic Training, Lackland AFB; Feb 2002 - June 2003, Presidio of Monterey, CA; June 2003-June 2005, Beale AFB, CA; June 2005 - June 2008, Misawa AB, Japan; June 2008 - Present, Goodfellow AFB, TX. 2 deployments to Baghdad, Iraq - July 2006-January 2007, March 2010-September 2010 With regards to hazardous duty, as mentioned in my tours above, I've been deployed to Iraq twice as an analyst. 2006 was definitely more hairy, but I honestly had a harder time the 2nd time around in 2010. More political stresses than combat, it seemed. As to prayer in combat, as long as its done privately and doesn't hamper accomplishment of the mission, I have no problem with it. But the military doesn't seem to see it that way, particularly the private side of it. My biggest issue currently is the tendency of the military to trot out a chaplain at every major event - be it a commanders call, change of command ceremony, drill competition, etc - and have them ask everyone to bow their heads and pray to 'the Lord', apparently meaning Jesus.

It's bad enough being an atheist and having to hear that (not that I bow my head, I usually spend the prayer looking around to see how many other non-praying people I can spot), but I can't imagine how offensive it must be to people there who may privately worship other things. It does not fit with the party line in the military that we support freedom of religion and/or religious tolerance. Its official endorsement of Christianity, as far as I'm concerned.

Air Force Lieutenant Colonel Christine Legawiec Board Member Specialty: C-130 Pilot Dates of Service: 1996-present Decorations: Aerial Achievement, Meritorious Service, GWOT Service Tours of duty: Kuwait, 2000; Balkans, 2000-2005; OEF, 2001-2005; OIF, 2003-2004, ONE, 2008 I'm excited for the day when all Airmen will be respected and celebrated for their diversity, including Humanists. At the end of the day, what matters most isn't your race, gender, religious beliefs, or sexual orientation, but whether you can live up to the core values and ensure a climate of respect and inclusivity for all Airmen. Marine Sergeant Joshua Greenfield Specialty: Combat Camera Dates of Service: April 2004 - April 2012 Decorations: (1) Afghanistan Campaign Medal, (1) Iraq Campaign Medal, (1) Global War on Terrorism Service Medal, (2) Marine Corps Good Conduct Medal, (1) National Defense Service Medal, (1) NATO Medal-ISAF Afghanistan, (1) Navy and Marine Corps Achievment Medal, (3) Sea Service Deployment Ribbon Tours of duty: Iraq: Feb 2005 - Feb 2006. Afghanistan: April 2009 - April 2010, March 2011 - Present Being a Marine and an atheist is an interesting challenge. The three pillars that the Corps values are founded on are 'God, Country, and Corps.' I can honestly say that I've never been discriminated against personally, but that's only because I generally don't make my atheism public. But I will definitely speak up when I hear a fellow Marine spouting ignorant religious dogma.

Most of them don't even know why they're religious in the first place! That being said, it sometimes feels like I'm the only one. I know that's not true at all, which is why I joined this group, to meet other atheists in the military. There's one thing I know for certain, that if it wasn't for religion, I wouldn't be stuck in this hell hole of a country fighting an invisible enemy.

Atheists as a whole need to be more assertive, with respect, to help people see the folly of their archaic beliefs. I know it's not easy, but I'm in it for the long haul. Let's get organized and let others know we're here! Air Force Staff Sergeant Brandon Crilley Specialty: Avionics Tech Dates of Service: 17 June, 2003 to present Tours of duty: MacDill AFB 2004 to 2011, Dover AFB 2011 to present I am proud to serve a country that allows us the freedom to criticize ideas, even when they are held by the majority.

I am proud to serve a country whose founding fathers understood the importance of separating religion from government. I am proud to serve a country that allows the free exchange of knowledge and wisdom, even if damaging to long standing institutions. I am a Atheist proudly serving America. Army Sergeant Gene Miller Specialty: combat medic Dates of Service: Oct 17 67-69 Decorations: Combat Medical Badge, Bronze Star with V, National Defense Service Medal, Vietnam Service Medal W/4 Bronze Stars, Vietnam Campaign Medal w/Device 1960, 2 Overseas Bars, Army Good Conduct Medal, Republic of Vietnam Gallantry Cross with Palm Unit Citation Badge, Republic of Vietnam Civil Actions Honor Medal First Class unit Citation Badge, Expert M-14, M-16 Tours of duty: Vietnam and Ft Benning I was in Vietnam from Apr 4 68-69. In combat prayer is just talking to the wind.

Whether you're hit or not is just a matter of luck. We averaged 212 days of combat and during WWII they averaged 40 days.

In Vietnam only 9% fought and the rest were in the rear with the gear. We got water from streams and were resupplied with food every 4 days. One fellow trooper believed that God would take care of him.

The next day his brains were in my hands. Army Captain Jason Torpy Board Member, Specialty: Quartermaster Dates of Service: Jun 1994 - Mar 2005 Decorations: National Defense Service Medal, Good Conduct Medal, Army Commendation Medal, Army Achievement Medal, Army Parachutist Badge, German Leistungs Ab Zeichung Tours of duty: Operation Iraqi Freedom May 2003 - July 2004 From my earliest days in the military, religion, and Christianity specifically were prevalent, creating the implication that I, as an atheist, was not a full part of the team. I hope the military embraces the diversity of its ranks creating training, outreach, and support programs for nontheists that are equivalent to those of the privileged Chrsitian community. Navy Master Chief Petty Officer Larry Bucher Specialty: Communications Dates of Service: 1952-56, 1958-77 Decorations: Two Navy Achievement Medals and about eight geographical medals Tours of duty: 1952-53 boot camp and a service school. 1953-54 USS Iowa. 1954-55 Naples Italy. 1955-56 London England.

1958-59 another service school (converted me from Teleman to Radioman). 1959-61 NAVCOMMSTA Asmara (Ethiopia). 1962 USS Rhodes. 1963-65 Naples again. 1966 USS Franklin D Roosevelt. 1967-68 NAVSUPPACT Danang. 1969-71 Asmara again.

1971-73 Naval Air Station Dallas TX. 1974-77 COMCRUDESGRU TWO (cruiser-destroyer group, rear admiral's staff) Newport RI briefly then Charleston SC.

Although I spent 19 months in-country Vietnam, it was in a relatively safe rear area and I never experienced anything resembling combat, never carried a weapon, and never felt myself in any imminent danger, not even during Tet. Plus another five-six months on a ship offshore. I'm reasonably sure that if ever in combat the closest thing to a prayer I might have uttered would have been, 'Oh, shit!'

In 1952 boot camp we were told that everyone had to go to a religious service Sunday morning -- unless you had identified yourself as an atheist on your enlistment papers. But it was apparent that it was not being enforced, no names taken, so after the first couple weeks only the incorrigibly devout continued to attend.

On my first ship a friend and I were caught on the quarterdeck when the chaplain came on the PA system for the evening prayer. Masters-at-arms yelled at us to take off our hats. In Naples a friend was hassled when he reenlisted; he had indicated atheist on his reenlistment papers, some meddler in personnel brought it to the chaplain's attention and the chaplain called him in for spiritual reclamation. Neither converted the other.

In Danang I had to get the chaplain's initials on my request for six-month extension. It went well until the end, when he asked my religion. I had no choice but to endure his grumpy disapprobation which was thankfully brief, and included indictment of Radiomen in general. Some of my sailors had earlier earned his disapproval.

In the 50s, beards were legal with prior approval, but as beards became identified with hippies, radicals, the 60s counterculture, they fell out of fashion were banned in 1982. Army Staff Sergeant Matthew Handley Point of Contact Specialty: Fire Support Sergeant Dates of Service: 2009 - Present Decorations: Army Achievement Medal (4OLC), Army Commendation Medal (2OLC) Tours of duty: Operation Iraqi Freedom 2009-10 I've still got about three weeks left in Romania before I get back to Germany. I am really interested in trying to get a group started in the Vilseck/Grafenwoer area. I have continued to meet like-minded individuals here just in my troop. I imagine there are many more back in garrison.

I read a lot of info on the MAAF website. I have been considering talking to the chaplain just to get a feel for what kind of support can be provided out here in our semi-deployed environment for humanists. They have gone to great lengths to build a Chapel on our little base, provide bibles, show religious movies, set aside protected time for services, etc. I'm just not sure what is in the scope of his responsibilities/requirements are or what really to ask for. What are some good questions to ask in an initial conversation? I'm very happy to be a part of the community.

Looking forward to being more involved. Air Force Reserve Tech Sergeant Mike Mathers Specialty: Air Transport Dates of Service: 2004-2011 (active) 2011-present (reserve) Tours of duty: April 2004-Feb 2009 Travis AFB, CA, Feb 2009-Feb 2010 Osan AB, Republic of Korea, Feb 2010-Apr 2011 Dover AFB, DE (July 2010-Jan 2011 LSA Anaconda/Balad AB, Iraq), Apr 2011-Present Joint Base Lewis-McChord, WA I became a christian my freshman year of highschool and was a sincere (if naive) believer until just recently. Earlier this year (2014) while studying WWI and the Battle of Verdun in particular I decided that God simply cannot exist. The fact that Man is capable of such profound horror has solidified not only my Atheism but my Anti-Theism. As a consequence of my time and experiences as a Christian I have an empathetic perspective and this keeps me from becoming hostile toward (most) other Christians.

Navy Petty Officer 2nd Class Eric Uhden Specialty: Legalman Dates of Service: Apr 2005-present Decorations: 3 Air Medals, 3 Army Achievement Medals, 2 Navy Achievement Medals, Humanitarian Medal, Sea Service, Overseas Tours of duty: 2010, six months Camp Basrah, Iraq; Air Ambulance, 2009, USS Essex/USS Denver; Japan, Australia, Typhoon Morokot Humanitarian mission, Taiwan, Air medevacs, 2008, Camp Buerhing, Kuwait; Air Ambulance, 2007, Camp Buerhing, Kuwait; Air Ambulance During mortar attacks in Iraq when it was at its worst I prayed, not religiously, but philosophically. I still have hope and experience wonder and marvel at the universe. As an atheist I have sought a Navy Chaplain when I needed to talk to someone and they were great.

I would love to see an atheist or humanist Chaplain because their views are more in line with mine. I am concerned with a few things with religion and the military. First is having -so help me God- in the reenlistment. I requested not to have it in mine but others, like people in the Air Force do not have that option.

Christian phrases like that should be completely eliminated from the military to complete the separation of church and state. Another example I have seen is during change of commands, graduations, Navy Balls, Command Christmas Parties, where there are Christian invocations. I've voiced my concerns and was told it is tradition and that it is for the religious people.

What about people like me who do not want religion at all in the military. Religion needs to be out of the military completely. Army Captain Marshall Forrest Specialty: Signals Intel Dates of Service: Jan 1942 - January 1946 Decorations: WWII expeditionary medals Tours of duty: North Africa and Salerno invasion to Rome You can be a good patriot and a good and moral person without any formal religious beliefs. I worked with cryptography teams in North Africa and then ran a telephone company in occupied Rome.

I had the opportunity in Yalta to run cryptography messages. In running intelligence separately, I had the opportunity to get confirmation of the atomic bomb blast prior to the Pentagon notification.

After the military, I served as a judge in Bellingham, Washington. I wasn't able to be out about my atheism as a judge or lawyer, but I hope others will be able to be out in the future.

Army Private Joshua Lopez Specialty: watercraft operator Dates of Service: 6 May 2013- present Tours of duty: Operation Enduring Freedom (Kuwait), 15 Sep 2013 to present Well I guess I will start off about prayer in combat. I think its a positive thing if it helps a soldier deal with stress on the battle field, but I strongly believe it should be done in private. Having group prayer is insensitive to individuals who do not subscribe to the certain religion of the prayer sayer. We usually have a christian chaplain say either grace or bless the unit when we have get togethers.

I would consider this religious tolerance from an atheists point of view, but I think if the tables were turned we would see discrimination. Marine Lance Corporal Steffen Camarato Specialty: Maintenance Management Specialist Dates of Service: June 2006 - June 2010 Decorations: Good Conduct Medal, National Defense Service Medal, Global War on Terrorism Service Medal My thought about prayer in combat, I don't have issues with it if someone wants to pray to themselves separately. However, when they try to include everyone as a whole to do it, I find it discriminating and useless. What I dislike about religion in the military is how biased it is.

You will see a chaplain, who is from some form of a Judeo-Christian religion. However, where is the secular counselors?

We need people to discuss these ideas of Atheism and to answer questions who are not biased and tell you to read the bible. I stood in many ceremonies where you bow your head and make a prayer. An Atheist in the military?

Well, good job, now you get to work on Sunday because you obviously have nothing to do on Sundays right? It's pitiful, and any government should be secular. People in power should not be biased because of religion. Army Sergeant 1st Class Robert Riddle Specialty: Combat Engineer Dates of Service: 30 Dec 1986 to 30 March 2008 Decorations: The only one that matters is the Sapper Tab Tours of duty: OIF Aug 06 to Nov 07 Anything that increases a soldier or soldier's family's strength and resilience and enables them to emotionally bear combat and it's aftermath is worth using.

That includes prayer. I never minded invocations at ceremonies, I just stood there silently while others took strength, solace, peace, or otherwise communed with their imaginary friend. One thing I learned early in my Army career is that you really have to work hard to be a bigot, the Army is so diverse that you really do realize that assholes come in all colors, as do great people and lifelong friends. There are religious zealots who treat atheists and people not of their faith unfairly.

But since the command climate changes with the commander, they usually only last a couple of years before they rotate out and a person who represents the actual ethics and values of the Army assumes command. There is culture of faith in the military because some people find strength in it.

There is a culture of protestant faith in the military because the majority of religious folks in the military are protestant. It's more of a logistics thing than anything else. If you are going to recruit chaplains to leverage the power of religion for better readiness and mental health of the force, and your force is 75% protestant, you would be an idiot to recruit 50% catholic or Islamic chaplains. Atheists, more than any other group, can actually place the needs of the service first, and just stand aside and let their brothers and sisters take whatever strength they can from their religion. We need to speak up if we are discriminated against, but religion isn't going away, and our mission shouldn't be to drive it away.

Army Sergeant Kayla Williams Specialty: Arabic Linguist Dates of Service: 2000-2005 Decorations: Army Achievement Medal, Army Commendation Medal (w Oak Leaf Cluster), Army Good Conduct Medal, Global War on Terrorism Service Medal, Iraq Campaign Medal, National Defense Service Medal Tours of duty: Iraq, 2003-2004 As a secular humanist, I often felt uncomfortable with the prayers that were part of every formal military ceremony. I also witnessed more overt discrimination: while studying Arabic at the Defense Language Institute, one of our professors passed out Christian materials in class, and then called every Christian student up to hold a prayer circle immediately before our oral proficiency exams - leaving the Mormons, Hindu, and me sitting in our seats, mouths agape at how wildly inappropriate it was. It has since pained me to see news coverage of some egregious missteps by military personnel and consultants who have allowed the misperception that the US is involved in a war on Islam be used in terrorist propaganda. The creeping evangelism in the US armed forces is deeply disturbing and undermines core American values.

I am proud to be able to raise my hand whenever someone repeats the tired and false trope 'there are no atheists in foxholes' to say, 'Actually, I was.' Serving in combat did not turn me into a believer! It did, however, show me the value excellent chaplains can bring to those coping with the stresses of combat.

I hope that more Unitarian Universalists will choose to serve as chaplains and that the military finds a way to incorporate secular chaplains into the corps in order to better serve the large number of us who are not religious. Army Chief Warrant Officer 3 Dick Mcmanus Specialty: Counterintelligence Special Agent/MI Dates of Service: Jun 1968 to May 1971, May 1981 to Sept 2001 Tours of duty: South Vietnam May 1970 to May 1971, West Germany 1981 to Sept 2001 HONOR, duty, Country. I think all humans need a philosophy to understand if they are happy. Here is mine. HAPPINESS IS GETTING WHAT YOU NEED.

EVERYONE NEEDS: Liberty, peace, health, sex, mind exercise, knowledge, personal associations, art and creativity, character and a sense of justice, and to be assertive (to be able to say 'no' without feeling guilty. NO ONE NEEDS ARBITRARY POWER OVER OTHER PEOPLE.

I also adhere to the importance of being assert - The Assertive Option by Patricia Jakubowski and Arthur J. Lange and NO TRESPASSING by Barker and Barker. Army Staff Sergeant Kevin Reed Specialty: All Source Analyst Dates of Service: July 2002 - present Decorations: ARCOM (4OLC), Good Conduct Medal (3 knots), Iraq Campaign Medal-Combat Service (1 star), Afghanistan Campaign Medal (1 star), Joint Service Acheivement Medal, Overseas Service Ribbon (3 tours) Tours of duty: Republic of Korea (Feb 2004-May 2006), Iraq (2009-10), Afghanistan (2012-Present) Everything in combat is stressful. Regardless where one finds themselves, stress compounds and builds. Some people release their stress into prayer, yet, all too often find out that prayers go unanswered.

Many chaplains I have encountered have been pretty open to athiests in the ranks, and one even supported our athiest group. Yet, in the current command climate I'm in, I am discouraged by the amount of religious propaganda that is perpetuated and accepted by senior command. Science, logic, and reason must be at the forefront of all military leadership.

Failure to do so with a faux belief in a diety will likely be akin to me wishing for the Kansas City Royals to win next year's World Series. As much as I want it to happen, unless I can play on the team and contribute to wins, it probably won't. Navy Petty Officer 2nd Class Bobby Daugherty Specialty: Logistics Specialist Dates of Service: April 2006 to April 2011 Decorations: National Defense Service Medal, Global War On Terrorism Service Medal, Global War On Terrorism Expeditionary Medal, Navy 'E' Ribbon, Navy Overseas Service Ribbon (2), Sea Service Deployment Ribbon (3), Navy And Marine Corps Achievement Medal Tours of duty: September 2006 to September 2009 USS STETHEM DDG-63, September 2009 to April 2011 VFA-97 Warhawks I was fortunate enough to not have to endure any form of discrimination due to my lack of faith.

I was afforded the opportunity while in the United States Navy to work amongst some of the finest people I have ever known. My only regret is that I am no longer with them. I was known to many I served with to be abnormally literate as I was always reading in my spare time. I think people are more tolerant of opposing views if those views are based on study.

I genuinely believe the majority of intolerance in this country comes from a lack of experience. I can honestly say that some of the more devout believers I worked with were some of the most noble as well. I can only hope that by having worked with me that they feel the same about an old heathern. Army Specialist Charles Hawes Specialty: Intelligence Analyst Dates of Service: Sep 2010 - present Decorations: Army Achievement Medal, National Defense Service Medal, ACM-CS, GWTSM, Army Service Ribbon Tours of duty: OEF 12-13 Sept.

2012- June 2013 I have not experienced any real discrimination from my unit and even have a leader who for the most part shares many of my views on religion, with the only difference being he is more agnostic where I am a total atheist. I did not consider myself a hardcore atheist until I began my deployment here in Afghanistan. I was content with saying I do not believe in god but others can if it is a comfort to them however, the longer I stay in this country the more resistant to the idea of religion I become.

Air Force Tech Sergeant Susan Ewin Specialty: Weather Forecaster Dates of Service: Oct 2000 - Present I consider myself a Humanist. Even before I knew what Humanism was I believed in humanity over religion. For the majority of my life I have been too terrified to every speak up or 'rock the boat' about anything, especially religion, but I have reached the point in my life that I am no longer content to let people just assume I am Christian. My family do not approve of my choice, but I've become angry at the hypocrisy of getting shipped around the world to fight religious fundamentalism, then brought back home to have another flavor of religious fundamentalism thrown in my face everywhere I turn. When I first came into the military I thought it was a truly equal career. Over the years I've come to see all the little discriminations that occur. Enough is enough.

I swore to uphold the Constitution, not the Bible. I am 'Good without God' and I refuse to hide anymore. Army Specialist Dennis Bailey Specialty: Cook Dates of Service: February 2008 - Present Tours of duty: Jun 2009 - May 2010, Mar 2012 - Present For the most part my Atheism hasn't been an issue except during my last deployment. I was struggling with a lot of stress and personal issues. I let the command know that I needed some help and asked to speak to mental health.

The next day the chaplain shows up at our site and proceeds to counsel me. I didn't get any help from him because I just couldn't take him seriously. I told him I was Atheist and all of his advice became about giving my problems to the lord. When he found out I was a non believer and having a rough time he saw the perfect opportunity to exploit my weakness and turn his efforts to converting me rather than helping me. I later got to see the actual combat stress and got the help I needed at the time, but the 'help' from the chaplain only succeeded in discouraging me more. Army Private 1st Class Spencer Morrell Specialty: Explosive Ordnance Disposal Dates of Service: 03OCT11 - Current Decorations: Army Achievement Medal I believe that two hands working does more good than one hundred clasped in prayer. Prayer, God, Faith, is a psychological crutch people use to get them through hard times.

No longer can we as adults turn to our parents as a source of comfort as we did as children. Instead we turn turn to a vibrant 2500 year story. Religion is rampant in the military, but only called upon when it is convenient.

The movie 'Kingdom of Heaven' spoke to this: 'I put no stock in religion. By the word religion I have seen the lunacy of fanatics of every denomination be called the will of god.

I have seen too much religion in the eyes of too many murderers. Holiness is in right action, and courage on behalf of those who cannot defend themselves, and goodness.' Air Force Lieutenant Colonel Paul April Specialty: Airframe Engineer Dates of Service: Jan.1962 - Oct.1985 Tours of duty: 1961-63: B-52G & KC-135 Maintenance, Blytheville AFB, AR, 63-65: Atlas Missile crew, Plattsburgh AFB, NY, 65-68: Titan II Missile Crew, Davis Monthan AFB, AZ, 1970: F4d aircraft maintenance, Ubon AB, Thailand, 1971-75: F111 Maintenance, McClellan AFB, CA I also served seven years (1985 -1992) engineering faculty (Mechanical Engineering), Penn State University, University Park, PA, Six Years (1992 - 1998) Sr.

Airframe Engineer, Hq. RSAF (Royal Saudi Air Force), Riyadh, Saudi Arabia. Navy Petty Officer 1st Class Tim Heilers Specialty: Submarine Sonar Technician Dates of Service: August 2001 - Present Tours of duty: USS Honolulu (Pearl Harbor, HI 2003-2006), USS La Jolla (Pearl Harbor, HI 2006-2008), USS Frank Cable (Apra Harbor, GU 2008-2010), COMSUBPAC Navy Data Center (Yokosuka, JP 2010-2012) I've been sort of casually indifferent towards religions for the majority of my naval career. I could never find the one that fit 'just right.' As a submariner, I found myself occasionally having to remind people that God can't see through the steel used in submarine hulls and that he can't help us down there.

Most often I'd just get a chuckle or a, 'You know, you're right.' The day that I first heard about the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, I knew that I had unknowingly been a devout Pastafarian for quite some time. I don't know anything about foxholes, but I'm sure there's plenty more atheists to be found in the silent service. Army Lieutenant Colonel Brian Robertson Specialty: Physician Dates of Service: June 1995-Present Decorations: Bronze Star Medal, Air Medal, Meritorious Service Medal, Army Commendation Medal Tours of duty: Flight Surgeon, Iraq Feb 2004-Feb 2005, Kosovo Apr-July 2003. Currently stationed at Ft. Benning, GA I don't really have any major problems with being an atheist in the military. It doesn't really come up very often.

But I suspect other soldiers might have an issue with it, so I thought I would add my name to the list. I have had okay experiences with chaplains but they don't really get involved too much in my current job; there are the ceremonial prayers that everyone seems to ignore or politely sit through at ceremonies.

I, like others, enjoy looking around for the other people who aren't joining in. I don't have to answer any questions or gotten any flak about my (lack of) beliefs, but I know this isn't always the case for enlisted soldiers. Navy Ensign Coey Sipes Specialty: computer network manager Dates of Service: Dec 2000 - Present Decorations: Airmedal/Strike (2) Joint Commendation Medal, Joint Service Achievement Medal, Navy Achievement Medal (2) various unit and campaign awards VQ-1 2002-2006 ISO Operation Enduring and Iraqi Freedom NIOC CO 2006-2010, NCTS Naples ISO Odyssey Dawn Ever since I had to learn the command 'Let us pray' I have been annoyed with religion in the military. While I was enlisted I went on numerous deployments and before we went on any of them we got our chaplain brief.

Let us pray for a safe return. I would rather not leave it up to some mythical entity to decide if I come home or not, I would rather rely on the actual people I'm working with and then we won't have to pray for anything. I was also a colorguard member. Where at nearly every event I had to listen to some prayer or another. When I was doing a colorguard for a funeral, I was fine with it because its what made the family and friends of the member feel better so I say, fine sure let the people pray, its their moment of grief, its their day, I was never upset about attending them because, I though if being here in uniform helps ease this families pain at all, then its worth it, its what I chose to do.

However, when I'm at the Navy ball I shouldn't have to bow my head in prayer or at a dining out or any other official military event. I think that for the predominately Christian population in the military, less main stream religions such as Muslim (there's only a handful of Muslim chaplains) and Buddhist are hard for them to handle atheism or agnostic generally are not favored. Navy Petty Officer 1st Class Francy Legault Specialty: linguist Dates of Service: Currently Serving Decorations: Navy Achievement Medal, Meritorious Unit Commendation, Good Conduct Medal, Sea Service Deployment Ribbon, Battle 'E' Ribbon, Global War on Terrorism Expeditionary and Service Medals, National Service Defense Medal, Pistol and Rifle Sharpshooter Ribbons Tours of duty: Deployed to the Persian in support of OEF and OIF 2006-2007 I believe prayer in combat is fine for individuals who believe. It shouldn't be forced on everybody because not everyone believes the same.

If they do want to hold a public prayer, then allow us atheists to leave for the duration of the prayer. I was deployed on the USS Dwight D. Eisenhower for 8 months to the Gulf and every night over the 1MC (the announcement system) was prayer.

I found it intrusive. I felt like a captured audience. Also, in boot camp, we were learning commands - right face, march, all that and 1 command is 'Let Us Pray' and we were told it didn't matter what we believed, when we heard that command, we HAD to bow our heads. So prayer is a command. I try as often as possible these days not to bow my head, most people don't notice because their heads are bowed.

I do find many people are very intolerant of nontheists, mostly these are the 'fundies.' I am absolutely an atheist in the foxhole.

Army Captain James Higgins Specialty: Patriot surface to air missiles Dates of Service: May 1998 to June 2006 Decorations: Meritorious Service Medal (MSM), Army Commendation Medal (ARCOM), Army Achievement Medal (AAM), National Defense Service Medal, Armed Forces Expeditionary Medal (AFEM), Global War on Terrorism Expeditionary Medal (GWOTEM), Global War on Terrorism Service Medal (GWOTSM), Army Service Ribbon (ASR) and Overseas Service Ribbon (OSR) Tours of duty: Operation Northern Watch, Incurlik AB, Turkey, 1999. Operation Southern Watch, Prince Sultan AB, Saudi Arabia, 2001. Operation Iraqi Freedom, Al Jabar AB, Kuwait, 2003. I also had assignments in Germany, Korea, Ft. Leonard Wood, MO, Ft. Bliss, TX, and Nellis AFB, NV Despite my multiple deployments to the Middle East, I never experienced what I would consider combat.

So, I do not use the term 'combat veteran' to describe myself and have no first-hand experience with prayer in combat. Regarding prayer in general, I conceptualize it as the western tradition of centering or meditation, and have no issues with those who chose to practice it on thier own or in groups of like-minded individuals.

Of course, I firmly believe that rational thought and personal responsibility are far better solutions to problems than wishing for a supernatural 'out' from life's trials! But if someone needs to indulge in a few minutes of quiet reflection, that doesn't bother me. I have only rarely directly experienced religious discrimination. Although, many, many times I silently rolled my eyes when chaplains would offer prayers at meetings, official social functions, before deployments, and at any other activity where everyone was forced to attend and listen. Especially the prayers offered 'in Jesus' name', which is presumptious, exclusionary and offensive to any non-Christian. I definitely have been made to feel excluded by others (including some, but not most chaplains) and I do feel that if I were more outspoken in my younger years about my disbelief, there would have been potential for far more. I also strongly object to compulsory religious services.

(Yes, they did happen. We weren't ordered into the chapel, but it was 'frowned upon' to object.). Navy Petty Officer 2nd Class Royce Hairston Specialty: Intelligence Dates of Service: Oct 09 - Current Decorations: Pistol Qualification, Global War on Terrorism, National Defense Tours of duty: NAS Fallon Sept 22 - Current I have not been in the Navy for very long, but during my service so far I have come across several instances of intolerance. The intolerance I have faced has not been from my chain of command but rather my fellow junior enlisted.

I would advise anyone with these problems to handle yourself with tact and discretion when making your point to your shipmates or combat partners. You can control the situation and make it tolerable if you maintain a cool head. Army Warrant Officer 1 Christopher Roberts Specialty: Flight Student Dates of Service: 23 AUG 2006 through present Decorations: Army Commendation Medal, Army Achievement Medal, Army Good Conduct Medal, Global War on Terrorism Expeditionary Medal, Iraq Campaign Medal with Campaign Star, Non-commissioned Officer Professional Development Ribbon, Army Service Ribbon, Overseas Service Ribbon, Combat Medical Badge Tours of duty: August-November 2006 Boot Camp, Fort Benning, GA. November 2006-May 2007 AIT, 68W (Medic) Fort Sam Houston, TX. May-June 2007 Reception and Rear Detachment at Fort Lewis, WA. June 2007-2008 OIF, Camp Taji and FOB Warhorse, (Husseiniyah, Rashitya, Baqubah, Tharir) Iraq.

June 2008-January 2009 HSB 2-12 Field Artillery, 4th Brigade, 2nd Infantry Division, Fort Lewis, WA. January 2009-March 2011, DiLorenzo TriCare Health Clinic, The Pentagon, Washington, DC. March 2011-Present, Warrant Officer Flight Training, (1st Warrant Officer Company and Bravo Company, 1-145th Aviation Regiment) Fort Rucker, AL I have been told to bow my head in respect to others during prayer at mandatory formations for changes of command/pass and reviews. I have never made a big stink about it, just ignored the order/guidance to bow my head and looked around at how rainy of a day it was at Fort Lewis, WA. Another thing I found to be very disheartening was being required to talk with our unit's chaplain after being involved as the Medic in an IED attack on our vehicle that killed our former platoon sergeant and wounded everyone else besides me. I was always told that 'God has a soft spot for Medics' but even after walking away with all my limbs and my life on that day, I held firm in my choice of being an Atheist. I didn't pray for the deceased 'soul' nor did I even think about meeting with the chaplain regarding the event.

When we met with the chaplain we were asked to pray and yet again, I found myself looking around the room thinking 'what are we accomplishing here again?' There was no divine presence there to help any of us through the event, just the guys sitting around being reminded of a really bad day. We had multiple occasions where our chaplain came out and asked that we pray before we went out on patrols/raids. I was always busy on missions being one of only 3 medics in our Battery so, I was there for most of these prayers thinking, 'Religion is why we are in this war in the first place, haven't you guys figured that out yet?' I am also not very fond of the morning prayers we had in Warrant Officer Candidacy School where the unit chaplain would be asked to pray after we concluded with PT.

During each ceremony we had at Candidate School, (after PT on different occasions, during the 'Senior Pinning' ceremonies, graduation and Oath of Office ceremonies), the chaplain was there to pray with us and I stood there trying not to think that I had more productive things to accomplish with my time than wasting it with prayer. It would be one thing if the formations weren't required but, who would want to miss their Appointment to WO1 ceremony because prayer was interwoven into the ceremony's events? Another side note I found to be very coercive was that all Service Members who were married were allowed to visit with family members during Sunday worship services while those who weren't religious or those who weren't married were stuck on work details during that period of time. The Candidate School Policy places a restriction on candidates having visitation while assigned to Candidate School with threats of elimination if found to be visiting when not on a pass. It gave the appearance that religious service members were rewarded for going to church while the rest suffered through work details and no visitation for six weeks. I had a long discussion one day with our chaplain in Iraq about his stance on faith and god and whether any of the stuff he earns a living preaching about was actually true.

He was very open to discussion and very stubborn to acknowledge the delusional nature of his stance on religion. He didn't take very kindly to being asked whether he feels that his faith was better defined as his delusion but still left the subject open to discussion. I tend to not profess to the world that I have no faith, as I do not need someone else' support to hold true to my views/non beliefs. There should however be a heck of a lot more support and consideration given to non believers in our Army and in our society. That is why I am here, I want to help this cause until there is no reason to be a part of it anymore.

Air Force Airman 1st Class Austin Standing Specialty: Aircraft Maintenance Dates of Service: Feb. 09 - Present Decorations: Air Force Training Ribbon, National Defense Service Medal, Global War on Terrorism Medal (Service) Tours of duty, with dates: BMT - Lackland AFB (Feb. School - Sheppard AFB (Apr. 09) Ramstein AB, Germany (Oct. 09 - Present) The main problem I have with prayer in the military is how it starts off almost every major event. Everyone is asked to bow there head and I have to put up with it.

A public prayer at a military event is unconstitutional. There's nothing wrong with a prayer in private as long as it doesn't interfere with the mission. Army Major Gareth Lintt Specialty: Army Engineer Dates of Service: Feb 95 - Current Tours of duty: Operation Iraqi Freedom, Jun 03 - Apr 04, Jan - Dec 06, Sep 07 - Dec 08; Operation Enduring Freedom, Jan 11 - ~Jan 12 If you're praying in combat you have too much time on your hands. If you're praying while deployed in a staff position you do not know how to do your job well enough and you're hoping something will come along and magic this knowledge into you. I do not know that I have experienced overt discrimination due to my lack of belief, I tend to just not discuss religion while working. I am also one of those people that does not bother bowing my head during prayers prior to ceremonies, or for whatever reason.

Never had anyone say anything to me either. And I would not expect anyone to, much easier to get away with non-theistic actions when you're an officer and on staff. Much more difficult for lower enlisted members when they have their immediate chain of command frowning on their actions. Navy Petty Officer 3rd Class Marc Latou Specialty: Nuclear Machinists Mate Dates of Service: 03FEB03 - 15MAY06 I believe we always were consider to be in some portion of Hazardous Duty, as we were always exposed to some higher than background level of ionizing radiation. As an ELT, we would be the first inside the Reactor Compartment after shutdown and have to ensure that the radiation/contamination levels where appropriate before allowing others inside. In addition, there was always a threat of a steam leak.

Prayer: I think that if any individual feels in necessary to pray, that's fine (and is well within their right). However, it should not be a unit event, in part to prevent any feeling of exclusion or discord between members of the unit. I think this idea fits well within core values and is or should be taught to recruits just like every other form of discrimination is.

I recall my boot camp RDC's frequently telling fellow recruits that they 'looked like brothers' -- that's how it should remain. Religious Tolerance/Discrimination: I did have some discriminatory experience with a professor at a local college while attending classes during my Navy time, he seemed to down-rate every form of religion that wasn't Christian. From my fellow sailors however, I would say that I had no issues with discrimination or intolerance. It rarely came up except from a questioning view, when referring to the war, I had several other sailors say 'isn't it all the same God?' Phrases like that led me to investigate, and think about my worldview, which eventually allowed me to admit that I couldn't believe in this God. When I sought help or advice there was a catholic chaplain, who, while very kind, seemed to have difficulty understanding the worldview I was expressing--and was thereby less helpful in alleviating my troubles and giving advice that was useful to me. Army National Guard Specialist Jacob Retz Specialty: Truck Driver/possible officer Dates of Service: 3/3/99 - 3/2/03 (Navy) and 11/7/10 (NG) Decorations: Sea Service Deployment Ribbon, Armed Forces Expeditionary Medal, Navy Unit Commendation, Meritorious Unit Commendation, National Defense Service Medal Tours of duty: USS Enterprise, Mediterranean Cruise, April '01 - October '01 (participated in first joint strike against Al Qaeda, off the coast of Pakistan, after 9/11.

(The planes flew over Pakistan and into Afghanistan.)). Air Force Lieutenant Colonel Robert Hill Specialty: 13S, Space & Missile Operations Officer Dates of Service: May 1990 - Present Decorations: Defense Meritorious Service Medal w/1 OLC, Meritorious Service Medal w/1 OLC, Air Force Commendation Medal w/2 OLCs, Combat Readiness Medal, Air & Space Campaign Medal Tours of duty: Malmstrom AFB, MT (1990-1995); Kadena AB, Okinawa, Japan (1995-1997); Schriever AFB, CO (1997-2001); Vandenberg AFB, CA (2001-2004); Fort Belvoir, VA (2004-2006); The Pentagon, Washington, D.C. (2006-2007); Stuttgart, Germany (2007 - Present). I am a former Southern Baptist that transformed into a very outspoken Agnostic over the last 12+ years, a journey started after my second daughter was still-born in 1999.

Every scrap of religious teaching came under scrutiny when every question I posed found a dead end, and from this blossomed the rational-thinking creature at the end of this post. Air National Guard Staff Sergeant Chris Kopps Specialty: Avionics Technician Dates of Service: January 2007 - Present I've always questioned faith, even when I was a little kid in catechism classes I found holes in religion that nobody seemed to have an answer for other than, 'Have faith' or 'God's ways are higher than ours.' But it wasn't until after Basic that I began to really explore what I believed in, and the answer was nothing. Since I admitted this to myself, and subsequently, to everyone else, I've been very lucky that nobody has been relentless in their proselytizing or discriminated against me for it, but I see it in the media every day, and I'm very glad there are organizations like MAAF and its partners to support atheists in their struggle for equality.

Army Sergeant David Lindberg Specialty: Medic Dates of Service: 2001-2005 Decorations: Expert Field Medical Badge (EFMB) Combat Medical Badge (CMB) and several other campaign and commendation awards and medals. Tours of duty: OIF 1 March 2003 - April 2004 I arrived at my atheism through skepticism and scientific inquiry. My atheism and anti-theism was reinforced by hearing the cries, in English and Arabic, for mercy or help from 'god' when a person was hurt and or dying. The help never appeared to come. Seeing humans die brutally, slowly, or without Hollywood style drama is a life, or rather, death-affirming experience. My family and I and thousands of others have paid dearly. I continue to 'fight' due to my 50% disability from PTSD.

Air Force Chief Master Sergeant William M. Cundiff Specialty: Public Affairs Dates of Service: May 1972-July 2002 Decorations: Defense Meritorious Service Medal; Air Force Meritorious Service Medal (3 awards); Air Force Commendation Medal (7 awards); Air Force Achievement Medal (4 awards); Outstanding Airman of the Year Ribbon During the first 10 years of my military career I was indifferent to religion, practicing none. I later voluntarily became a Roman Catholic, and then later (again voluntarily) became a Unitarian Humanist. Throughout my 30-year active duty career I was never hassled about religion. Things have changed. In both military and civilian life the evangelical religious virus has infected everything. Freedom of religion and freedom from religion are equally important to a just society.

I'm a member/supporter of the MAAF, the American Humanist Association, the Freedom From Religion Foundation, Americans United for Separation of Church and State, and the Military Religious Freedom Foundation in an effort to help inoculate society from the evangelical virus. I look forward to the day when there's no longer a need to support these organizations.

Air Force Lieutenant Colonel Mark Matson Specialty: Engineer Dates of Service: 1989-present Decorations: Meritorious Service Medal, Joint Commendation Medal, AF Commendation Medal, Achievement Medal Tours of duty: 9-93 Norton AFB, CA; 93-95 Osan AB, ROK; 95-98 Aviano AB, It; 98-00 Hickam AFB, HI; 00-02 NATO Programming Center Glons BE; 02-04 McConnell AFB, KS; 04-06 Nellis AFB, NV; 06-07 Maxwell AFB, AL; 07-present Pentagon Wash DC Grew up a Lutheran, went to Sunday School and Church through college. Started to become a real doubter though when I started watching Carl Sagan in COSMOS as a kid. Didn't really give it all much thought until I had my own children. I've always just kind of known that the many, varied stories of gods were just that, but it didn't bother me that others weren't able to see the same thing.

Lately my lack of belief has become more important to me as I realize the kind of societal and cultural brain washing that my kids are exposed to. It is hard to explain to them why daddy does not believe that 'God made us', 'that's what everybody else says is true'. Therefore, I am trying to learn as much as possible about the arguments for and against religion so I am ready to discuss it when they are old enough to ask real questions. Air Force Master Sergeant Sherry Burt Specialty: Bandsman Dates of Service: Nov 98-present My career field is made up of musicians who are generally liberal-minded or at least fairly tolerant. Still, nearly everyone is Christian and many are outspoken church-goers.

I freely express my views as a non-theist in hopes that folks will come to accept atheism/agnosticm. At the very least, I hope to avoid the usual asumptions about my beliefs. However, when I play a concert for an audience, the people in attendance nearly always assume Christian beliefs and shower me with 'God Bless Yous' and whatnot.

There is nothing I can do about this, and it is tolerable considering the general goodwill with which it is given. Still, it irks me somewhat, and I like to imagine a future where the 'A' word is not feared and mistrusted.

Army National Guard Specialist Brandon Figueroa Dates of Service: April 12th, 2005 - Present Decorations: Bronze Star w/ Valor, Purple Heart, Army Good Conduct Medal, Afghanistan Campaign Medal w/ Service Star, Army Commendation Medal, Army Achievement Medal, Overseas Service Ribbon, Combat Infantryman's Badge, NATO International Security Assistance Force (ISAF) Medal, Army Service Ribbon, Global War On Terrorism Medal Tours of duty: Operation Enduring Freedom - Afghanistan 2008-2009. Kabul, Nuristan, Kapisa, Kandahar, Logar, Bagram, Darulamon, Jalalabad. Air Force Major Tina Kinsley Specialty: physician Dates of Service: 9/1996 to present Tours of duty: stationed Osan AB, ROK in 2002/3 Here's what I don't understand: why we need to open official government functions with a prayer. At my MILTARY residency graduation, there were two separate prayers.

A moment of silence? Also, at Brooke Army Medical Center, San Antonio,TX, the chaplain sent out 'daily inspirations' with bible verses to EVERYONE. The JAG decided that we had to opt out of this. However, it seems to me that one should have to opt in. Oh, and the email in question was sent with a CC to the BG who ran the base, implying that the command had approved (and sanctioned) the religious-overtoned communiques. Navy Commander Jonathan Underwood Specialty: Naval Aviator Dates of Service: Feb 12, 1972 to Oct 30, 1994 Decorations: Naval Aviator Wings- Aircraft Carrier Qualified An ever increasing number of unchurched citizens are thriving in this Country who believe in thinking freely for themselves, using only science, reason and their own personal observations to guide them, and they refuse to allow the decrees and dogmas of religious authority and holy books in any way to interfere. They come with many tags - skeptics, atheists, unbelievers, humanists and so on.

They are generally not well thought of in this Country. We represent the contributions and aspirations of the millions of upright free thinkers in this Country, many of whom are veterans and retirees as I am. Our world views may be at variance with many, but we love this Country. Our allegiance to the United States is steadfast and unwavering in the same tradition as it was with our deist fore-bearers, Benjamin Franklin, Tomas Paine and Thomas Jefferson. It should be recognized that if exemplary citizens can be prejudicially reproached with 'guilt by association', then the logical inverse of that progression applies as well, and that is 'honor by association'.

It is my hope that for the 21st Century an informed Zeitgeist in America will include an awareness that closely held values including Duty, Honor, Country are not the sole domain of any single faction however large, or of any coalition of those who hold popular doctrines and creeds. We are 'one Nation,' although not under anybody's God, 'with liberty and justice for all.' Air Force Senior Airman Greg Russell Dates of Service: 19 July 2004 - 19 July 2008 Decorations: Air Force Achievement Medal, Air Force Meritorious Unit award, Air Force Outstanding Unit Award, Iraq Campaign Medal, Global War on Terrorism Service Medal, National Defense Service Medal, Air Force Expeditionary Service Ribbon (with citation for service in a combat zone) Tours of duty: Kirkuk Regional Air Base, Iraq; 2006-2007. And to do my part to dispel the no-atheists-in-foxholes adage, I served under fire--numerous times.

Army National Guard 1st Lieutenant William Bonin Dates of Service: 1987-1993, IRR until 2001. Decorations: Army Achievement Medal Tours of duty: Minnesota Army National Guard, Army Reserve While I did sit through some unit assemblies with the Chaplains (some mandatory, most not), I never had to deal with mandatory prayer. I took the time to read or nap and never faced any adversity for my lack of participation. I was never the only one reading/napping, and once commissioned I made sure that my people knew they didn't have to participate in any religious services even if they had to go.

Since my time was effectively all reserve duty, and in peacetime no less, my exposure to military evangelists was limited. I actually had a much harder time dealing with other officers due to the fact I was enlisted first than my lack of belief. Then again it was much easier to avoid the issue as an officer. Army Sergeant John Gill Dates of Service: April 2005-present Decorations: Bronze Star Medal, Army Achievement Medal, Army Good Conduct Medal, National Defense Service Medal, Iraq Campaign Medal, Global War on Terrorism Service Medal, NCO Professional Development Ribbon, Army Service Ribbon, Overseas service Ribbon, Parachutist Badge Tours of duty: Nasiriyah/Al-Kut/Al-Diwaniyah, Iraq Aug 2006-Nov 2007 My first glimpse of Army belief pushing came when I was standing on a parade field as a brand new private, refusing to bow my head for the chaplains prayer. My platoon sergeant told me afterward that even if I didn't believe in God, I should bow my head out of respect for those around me. I agreed as long he would bow his head with me and pray to some other god he didn't believe in.

He wouldn't and since then I've made it a point to stand extra straight with my chin up during every prayer I'm forced to listen to. I don't face too much discrimination, possibly because I'm very outspoken and set in my beliefs. I find it ironic that grown, educated men and women look down on people who don't believe in fairy tales. I was raised very religious and from as far back as I can remember I couldn't understand how someone could tell me that Santa wasn't real while spouting the Bible in the same breath. People told me that when bullets start flying, I'd find religion real quick. Well, the bullets flew and I'm proud to say that even when I felt fear, not once did I waste time begging imaginary friends to save me. I'm glad there's a group like this.

I know a lot of people who would benefit from this as they're very timid about letting on that they're atheist. For me it's a source of pride that I'm not superstitious.

Born on the 25th of December to a virgin, called the Son of God by his disciples, and risen from the dead three days after he was killed, we wish a happy birthday to Mithras, the mythological Persian god imagined 600 years before that other guy. Army Reserve Major Raymond Bradley Lay Leader III Specialty: Medical Service Corps Dates of Service: 1986 to present Tours of duty: Operation Enduring Freedom (Afghanistan) 2004-2005 It never bothers me to keep my head up in formation while others are praying.

And I've noticed over the years that more Soldiers do the same. I doubt there are that many more Atheists today.

Most likely, fewer feel afraid to reveal they are not Christian. And though religion is strong and apparent among many in the military.

I believe it is the un-bowed heads in the formation that remind the world that we are united by freedom above all else. Marine Master Sergeant LeRoy Bloom Dates of Service: Sep 1958 to June 1978 Decorations: Navy Commendation with 'V', Good Conduct Medal with five stars, Armed Forces Expeditionary Medal, National Defense Medal, Vietnam Service Medal with four stars, Vietnamese Gallantry Cross, Vietnamese Service Medal. Tours of duty: Vietnam Tours; June 1966 to June 1967 and November 1968 to December 1969 By the time I joined the Marines at age seventeen I was at least an agnostic, if not yet an atheist. I had no preference for religion on my dog tags and caught grief from the DI for it. We were forced to go to church on Sunday. Either you fell out as a Catholic or a Protestant and were marched to church.

In those days I was too intimidated by the DI to attempt refusal to attend Church. By the age of twenty I had become a confirmed atheist, and to this day have seen no reason to change my ideas. During two combat tours in Vietnam I was under fire my share, but I never thought of praying.

Instead I always tried to make a reasonable assessment of the situation, and tried to act accordingly. To have prayed, in my mind, would have been a waste of valuable brain resources better used in ensuring my, and those in my charge, surviving. My first tour was as an adviser to the Vietnamese Army.

I was the adviser to a Vietnamese Battery Commander. I got into several close scrapes, but again did not waste my time and mental resources in prayer. Army National Guard Sergeant Jordan Sawyer Specialty: Infantry Dates of Service: round July 2000 Tours of duty: Germany Jul 02 - Feb 03; Iraq Sept 08 - Sept 09 I believe prayer in combat is a healthy thing for theistic believers. Everyone has their own way of dealing with stress, hardship etc and I believe religion is a great way to handle that. Though its certainly not for me. I do on occasionally get a little grief when I step out of the room for a chaplain's prayer. My platoon and unit are very accepting of my Atheism.

In fact I'll get into some enjoyable debates with some of the Christians here. Usually around Creation vs Evolution. Air Force Senior Airman Adam Aleweidat Specialty: Munitions Systems Dates of Service: March 2007 - Present Decorations: Basic Military Training Honor Graduate and Warhawk, Munitions Systems Apprentice Course Distinguished Graduate, Expert Marksman (M16 and M9), Awarded Senior Airman Below-The-Zone Tours of duty: January 2009 - July 2009 (Qatar) I joined the Air Force just over two years ago. I was an atheist at the time, and am still an atheist today. The big difference is that in the beginning I wanted nothing more than to rid the world of radical religious chaos. I thought that joining the military would give me the opportunity to serve a country dedicated to rooting out religious fundamentalism.

I later realized that I wasn't fighting against the bad guys, I was just joining more religious nuts - a whole bunch of 'em - in fighting other religious nuts. I know that not everyone in the service chooses a dogmatic path, but quite a few do, and that's enough to turn me away from this lifestyle. Lately, I have been reading about Conscientious Objection and am realizing that this pertains to my situation almost exactly. I can't say that I wake up hating my job - I don't.

But I do wake up hating the fact that I'm supporting a war fought by two sides that have more in common than they think - religion! Heck, I'm Palestinian but am still much less similar to a radical Muslim guerilla than a blind-believing Christian is. My morality comes from reality, theirs from delusion. Thanks for reading.

Air Force Staff Sergeant Russell Case Specialty: medic Dates of Service: Aug 79 / Feb 82 Decorations: AF training Ribbon, AF Outstanding Unit Award / 1 device, Small Arms Expert Marksman's Ribbon Tours of duty: Keesler Medical Center, Biloxi Miss, Multiple TDY assignments - Europe, Japan, Philippines Religious proselytizing by the 'Born Agains' during my time serving as a surgical specialist / medic at Keesler AFB was profound and constant. It became intolerable after an officer I trusted found out I was a Atheist and told others in his christian group on base. At first it was the daily knock at my dorm room to 'Save my soul' and then the anger and harassment started, ranging from letters to being denied promotion and extra duty. My commander had no shame or hesitation in telling me that I was not fit to wear the uniform and there were no atheists in foxholes, and Christ was my only hope. After 2 years of this non stop dogma I told them where to stuff there crosses and left the Air Force soon after. I served with good men and women of many beliefs who never once made my atheism an issue, good friends and excellent medics.

Our patients then and now were our primary concern, and to see and hear a Chaplain with the surgeon standing in the room say to a patient who was Muslim 'you need to repent before surgery. Just in case' enough is enough! Army Chief Warrant Officer 2 Charles Kane Specialty: Aviation Dates of Service: Oct 2002-current Tours of duty: Afghanistan Feb 2006-Dec 2006 I haven't had to deal with too much discrimination (I know many that have however) though I have had to deal with the proselytizing of colleagues and the Army's annoying religious rituals that occur during every event or ceremony I've had to attend in the military. While deployed to Afghanistan I never once looked to the heavens in prayer nor have I ever acted in a cowardly manner.

All the strength and bravery I ever needed I found from within, proving that there are truly 'atheist in foxholes'. Navy Petty Officer 2nd Class Theresa Durkee Specialty: Aerographer's Mate Dates of Service: June 1978 to January 83 Tours of duty: NTC Orlando 1-79 to 3-79, Chanute AFB 3-79 to 6-79 (Aerograher's Mate A School), NAS Miramar (NWSED which changed to NOCD) 6-79 to 1-83 Specialty: AG (Aerographer's Mate) My experience in the Navy was positive and there was no Christian evangelism or proselytizing going on that I was aware of. We were encouraged to attend a church service of our choice on Sunday mornings while in boot camp, but other than that I do not remember any mention of religion. It is disgusting and appalling to read and hear about what has happened to our armed services over the last decade or so.

I can only hope that President Obama re-instates the Separation of church and state, follows the Constitution and returns our nation and our military to their former good standing in the world. Religious zealots, whether Christian, Jewish or Muslim, do not belong in positions of power and have always been (and will certainly continue to be) the most destructive force in the world. Army Sergeant KJ Kendall Specialty: Artilleryman, Prime Power Production Specialist Dates of Service: 2000-present Decorations: 5 Army Commendation Medals, 3 Army Achievement Medals, 3 Army Good Conduct Medals, National Defense Service Medal, Iraq Campaign Medal, Global War on Terrorism Expeditionary Medal, Global War on Terrorism Service Medal Tours of duty: Mosul/Nineveh '04-'05, Baghdad/Diyala '07-'08 I have devoted a great deal of pondering and marveling about the natural order of things.

This has gone on for years, and I don't see any end in sight. I feel that this is a healthy practice. The absence of theism fosters explorative, objective thought without the emotional constraints that religion imposes. People have a tendency, Americans especially, to live out their days in a socio-psychological bubble that they are comfortable with.

And understandably so, since it is much easier to live this way. 'That's how Mom/Dad always do it', or 'Pastor Dan says.' , or 'I dunno, Judge Bob gave his verdict. It must be so' - it is always easier to fall in line, rather than go against the grain.

When I was young, I felt the ubiquitous power of the cross and stood in awe before the eloquence of Holy Scripture, yet at the same time was puzzled by group rituals and the idiosyncrasies of its followers. Then I waded through the turbulent waters of teenhood, and solutions to my questions became even more muddled, but ironically, the more confusing it got, the more clear the answer became. There I sat on the fence without a religious preference as I joined the military at the age of 22. It was the Army that steeled my atheism. New experiences and all the exposure to other cultures popped my 'bubble'. I always give solid credit to the military for my personal revelations. Thank you, Uncle Sam.

In basic training, a fellow Private 'tattled' to our Drill Sergeant that I (oh-my-gosh) didn't believe in God. A lot of embarrassment ensued, and I was given 'special' treatment by him for the rest of my training. In leader development training, I got severely dehydrated during land-navigation. Some flunkie failed to stick an IV needle in my arm five or six times then volunteered to escort me to the hospital. During the entire 1-2 hours that he was with me, he vehemently tried to proselytize me.

He had a very creepy approach. I wish I was armed with the information and resolve that I have today. Similar occurences happen every day to some level or degree. The problems with military religiosity, or society as a whole are beyond the scope of my humble statements. I feel though, that the eventual extinction of human superstition and religion are inevitable. I only wish that I could see the day. As for combat operations, at no time did I feel it necessary to call upon prayer.

For me, that's natural. But for those that it provides solace. More power to them. It would be nice if religion didn't permeate everything that we do, but unfortunately that is the current state of our reality. Army National Guard Captain Ben Tupper Specialty: Infantry Officer Dates of Service: Sep 93 to current Decorations: Bronze Star, Combat Infantrymen Badge Tours of duty: May 06- May 07 My only comment would be that while I was in Afghanistan, I was embedded in the Afghan National army, and the biggest impediment they have to development is their religious fervor. They will neglect training, because in their logic, it's a waste of time because their god will decide if they live or die.

In their mind, training is pointless. It's all 'insh'allah' (if god wills it). Its a classic example of how fundamentalism, of any stripe,retards human growth and progress. Army Sergeant Aaron Couture Specialty: Intelligence Dates of Service: 2004-Present Decorations: Joint-Service Achievement Medal, Army Achievement Medal, Afghanistan Campaign Medal Tours of duty: Afghanistan, March-September 2005 Upon first entering the military, I was dismayed to be required to attend Easter services during Basic Training.

Although I have not experienced direct discrimination due to my open Atheism, I experience on a daily basis the culture of ignorance and closed-mindedness that is the US Military. The broadcast of Pro-Christian media on government television overseas, without a single Atheist or even non-christian broadcast is troublesome. When speaking out about such issues, I am told that this is the way the Military is, and that if I don't like it, I don't have to stay in.

I did not experience much direct fire while deployed, but never once did I ever have the slightest notion that I would need or want 'God's' protection. Air Force Captain Stefan Hamelin Specialty: Physician Dates of Service: Jul 94 to present Tours of duty: ADAF Enlisted 94-01, ADAF Officer 01-present Fortunately, I've only had to endure the prostlytizing of colleagues and the mild annoyance of having imaginary men thanked and praised for my hard work during various ceremonies.

Still, the military hospital can be a lonely place for an atheist, as deism has often been a part of armies through the centuries and my belief in God is almost implicitly accepted by many who view the the physician as a healing tool of divine power. I am grateful for groups like this that not only enable atheists to connect with each other, but also allow other to see that we are alive and well in all areas of the military. Army Lieutenant Colonel Stephen Murphy Specialty: Space Operations Officer/Enigneer Officer Dates of Service: May 14, 1994 to Present Decorations: Meritorious Service Medal, Army Commendation Medal, Army Achievement Medal, Overseas Service Ribbon Tours of duty: Iraqi Freedom Dec 05 - Nov 06 I currently work in a 3-Star command and about 90% of my coworkers are DA Civilians or Contractors. I immediately noticed the proliferations of religious (Christian) artifacts, religious quotes, bumper sticks, etc.

Engine Serial Number Check there. That surrounded me. It pushed me further into my non-belief. After having recently completed my master's degree, I have taken to studies of Atheism, Evolution, and Christianity in an attempt to understand the 'virus of the mind' that has taken such a strong hold in the United States. As I read more and more, I increasingly consider the possibility of retiring to England or Northern Europe. Air Force Staff Sergeant Fredric Schmeelk Dates of Service: 1993-2001 Tours of duty: Griffiss AFB, NY, Oct.

'94, Charleston AFB, SC, Aug. '01 I was pretty weak in my atheism when I first joined and had the 'No religious pref' on my dog tags. The longer I was in, the stronger my atheism got. I found fellow atheists through the internet in late 2000, and that really helped me figure things out. I resent the idea that we are not as patriotic as anyone else in this country. If I had to do it over, the only thing I'd change is asking to put 'Atheist' on my dog tags. Otherwise, I'd serve just as honorably.

Air Force Colonel Ariel Thomann Specialty: Chief Flight Surgeon Decorations: Air Force Commendation Medal, Army Commendation Medal, others Tours of duty: Army Senior Medical Student Program 1962-63, Army Reserve during Internship 1963-64, US Army Dispensary, Ft. Clayton, Canal Zone 1964-65, USARSO Surgeons Office, Ft. Amador, Canal Zone 1965-67, 614 Tactical Fighter Squadron and USAF Hospital, Torrejsn Air Base, Spain 1979-83, USAF Regional Hospital, Sheppard AFB, Texas 1983-86, 147 USAF Clinic, Ellington ANGB, Houston, Texas 1986-90, IMA USAF Reserve, Wilford Hall Medical Center, Lackland AFB, Texas 1991-96 While bored, at age 10-12, I happened to read a hymnal and found that the hymns I had parroted for years were absurd. In high school, the father of a classmate said he was not bound by the ideas of bronze-age desert nomads, and that reactivated my thinking.

I flirted with religion in college but realized the absurdity of the 'leap of faith' I was being asked to take. I still have an American Atheists certificate of membership signed by Madalyn Murray O?Hair. I also still have my last set of military dog-tags, and they say ATHEIST. For about 10 years I have studied our Revolutionary period and the Founding Fathers, with emphasis on the 1787 Constitutional Convention. This was NOT meant to be a 'Christian Nation.'

Army Sergeant 1st Class Steven Ledbetter Specialty: musician Dates of Service: Sep 1977 - Mar 1996 Decorations: Meritorious Service Medal (2), Army Commendation Medal (6), Army Achievement Medal (4), Overseas Service Ribbon (2), Army Parachutist Badge Tours of duty: Frankfurt, Ger 1982-1885, Berlin, Ger 1992-Aug 1994, Bamberg, Ger Sep 94 - Nov 95 Prayer is a personal thing; silly in my view. However, since many people feel better doing this, then go for it.

However, I do not wish to be forced to be around such nonsense. While I was a midshipman at the US Naval Academy, we were required to attend religious services on Sundays. It was during this time that I started to define myself as an atheist. I did not suffer any religious discrimination while on active duty.

Although I was unable to get dog tags saying atheist, that has changed recently. When I took the oath of reenlistment, I spoke with the officer reading the oath prior and had him delete the phrase '.so help me, god.' I haven't been so lucky in my civilian career.

I believe my Atheism affected my position as a teacher while in Harlingen, TX. Although I cannot prove it, I believe that when I left, recommendations from my previous administration were less than stellar due to my open atheism and challenges to School Policy.

Army Chief Warrant Officer 3 Steven Freund Specialty: Helicopter Pilot Dates of Service: 5 Jan 99 to present Decorations: ASR, OSR, GWOTS, NDSM, AGCM, AAM, NCOPDR, ARCOM Tours of duty: Iraq: April 03-July 03 I haven't had too many bad experiences with discrimination. In fact, I tend to seek out the Christian fundamentalists in each unit that I go to and try to befriend them so that we can have 'lively discussions' on religion. However, a few instances of minor discrimination come to mind. While I was in WOCS school, my wife came to get some info from the commander in charge of the school. When he sat my wife down to explain how she could visit me during church, my wife politely informed him that we do not go to church. He said something to the effect of 'May God have mercy on your soul' while giving her a look of shock.

My wife was also in the Army (we have been together since before the military), and in basic training her drill sergeants ignored the fact that she didn't want to pray in formation. Other than that, the only thing that I have a problem with is the organized prayer before any ceremony. I refuse to bow my head. I have also been fairly lucky to find at least one non-believer in most units that I have been in. Army Lieutenant Colonel Dick Renfro Specialty: Infantry Operations Dates of Service: Enlisted in the National Guard, 1948; Regular Army 1949. Commissioned from West Point, 1954.

Retired, 1979. Decorations: Combat Infantryman's Badge Tours of duty: RVN, 1966-67, XO, 3d Battalion, 22d Infantry, Other overseas assignments: Korea (2 tours), Japan, England. I guess I was fortunate in that I never ran in to any blatant religious discrimination or intolerance. That is why I am so appalled at what is going on in the Armed Forces today. It ain't your daddy's army. Air Force Reserve Captain Jason Renner Specialty: Civil Engineer Dates of Service: 2002-2007 Decorations: Commendation Medal There is a strong Christian presence in day to day military operations.

The judeo-christian god is referenced in oaths of re-enlistment, commission oaths, promotion ceremonies, retirement ceremonies, and even large squadron outings. I have nothing against Christians or any other religious person, but the idea of a creator being looking over us like a puppet on a string is kind of silly. There has to be more to life than spending eternity in Club Med with Jesus or breaking rocks in hell with Satan. Navy Seaman Justin Allen Specialty: Deck Seaman Dates of Service: March 8th 06 - current Decorations: Global War on Terrorism, Global War on Terrorism Expeditionary, Sea Service, National Defense, Battle 'E' Tours of duty: 1 Jan 06 to 16 Jul 06 and 27 Jan 07 to 20 Apr 07 - USS Ronald Reagan CVN76 My job can be dangerous, heavy steel lines can break and the flailing can take a limb off or just knock someone into a wall and kill them. A line can get caught on your foot and pull your body through a 1 sqft hole. Nasty stuff, balanced by the vast majority of our training being about safety.

There is nightly prayer while underway. Depending on the chaplain praying, its either a morale rally bit about sticking it through and some genuine positive commentary or it's a guy who drones on about how blessed the christian faith is.

It gets particularly preachy near holidays. I've had nothing like atheist beatings or anything, just occasional yelling and angry escalation. Air Force Captain Michael Huntingford Specialty: Aerospace Control Dates of Service: Mar 74 - Apr 04 Decorations: Order of Military Merit, Meritorious Service Medal, Joint Meritorious Service Medal, United Nations Emergency Force II, Canadian Forces Peacekeeping Service Medal, Deputy CINC NORAD Commendation, Canadian Forces Decoration with clasp, Air Force Commendation Medal with 4 devices, Queen Elizabeth Jubilee Medal, others Tours of duty: Tours of duty, with dates: Many locations over 30 years including CFB Edmonton, Gagetown, and North Bay, as well as Egypt and NORAD.

During my service as a Regimental Policeman in Egypt (May - Nov 1979), I had several events that were life-threatening. One was the apprehension, arrest and detention of two knife-welding Egyptian Nationals that penetrated the UN camp.

The other more significant event was a sniping and small arms fire fight with an unknown number of aggressors that were intent of forcing the UN to move out of Eygpt. Later, they were identified as elements of Al-Gama'a al-Islamiyya (same group behind the assassination of Egyptian President Anwar Sadat in 1981).

Although the sniping and the follow-on fire fight were of short duration, it was intense nonetheless. Although stressful, there was no praying that I recall - at least not from me. Army Staff Sergeant Joshua Kaminoff Specialty: Intelligence Analyst Dates of Service: June 1996 - December 2003 While discrimination against Atheists in the military is rarely demonstrable, there is a definite feel of state-sponsored Christianity. Every retirement ceremony has a chaplain, and I've seen more than one held in a church. There were many times I was in formation and we would all bow our heads at once when the Chaplain began his sermon. A couple of times I simply didn't bow my head, and hoped that someone would try to make a big deal out of it later (which never happened, unfortunately). I had several other service members tell me I would go to hell because I was an Atheist.

I ended up getting a new set of dog tags made just before I got out that said Strong Atheist instead of the No Religious Preference ones I was given in boot camp. It made me feel better, if nothing else. Army Captain Marcus Byrne Specialty: Field Artilery Dates of Service: Enlisted in the Army Reserve in 1999 decided I wanted to go active duty, so I went to college and received my commission in 2004.

Decorations: ronze Star Medal, National Defense Service Medal, Army Achievement Medal (1OLC), Overseas Ribbon, Army Reserve Component Achievement Medal, Reserve Component Overseas Training Ribbon, GWOT Expeditionary Medal, Army Service Ribbon, Combat Action Badge, Parachutists Badge Tours of duty: Tall Afar, Nineveh Prov., Iraq January-May 2006; Ramadi, Al Anbar Province, Iraq, June 2006 to March 2007. Assignments: 417th Quartermaser Company, USAR, Cp. Atterbery Indiana; 1/330th IN REGT, 84th DIV (IT), USAR, Fort Wayne, Indiana. Ball State University ROTC. Sill for Field Artillery Officers Basic Course (May to Nov 2004); Giessen, Germany 2d Battalion 3rd Field Artillery Regiment as a Fire Support Officer for 1-37 Armor, Battery Fire Direction Officer, and Motorized Rifle Platoon Leader (Nov 2004 to Present).

Even thought I think religion is idiotic brainwashing I'm very libertarian about it. People can do whatever they want as long as they don't expect me to join in their idiocy.

It would be like me going and getting a lobotamy and telling everyone to join in. Every formal function in the military is started with a prayer. Always by a Christian and mostly Protestant Chaplain. I know for a fact the same people that are bowing their heads and earnestly praying to their imaginary friend would be in an uproar if they sent a Wiccan priestess up to the podium to give the Benediction. I mean it's equal opportunity right? But that would be just silly, because the Wiccan goddess isn't real, only their imaginary friend is real. I've been to many functions and everytime it irks me when they do the benediction, because it's this sort of unstated arogance and entitlement of the tyrannical majority.

But I've also noticed over the years as I stand up and look around, the number not participating does seem to be getting larger. I've never really noticed anyone praying before we've gone on missions. But we all have our lucky charms and mini-rituals. Even I had them and I'm the biggest skeptic out there. But if it makes people feel better as long as they dont expect me to buy into their BS, I dont care what they do. Navy Petty Officer 2nd Class Zenas Van Slyck Specialty: Engineman Dates of Service: 5/13/74 - 5/12/78 Decorations: National Defense Service Medal, Navy 'E' Ribbon, Navy Good Conduct Medal Tours of duty: NAS Guam 10/74-1/76, USS Grapple (ARS-7) 2/76-11/77, USS Bryce Canyon (AD-36) 12/77-5/78 There were times in rough weather, in mid Pacific when I had my fingers crossed, but I didn't and wouldn't resort to prayer. I had no negative experience of religious intolerance or discrimination while in the Navy.

Navy Petty Officer 2nd Class Joel Wheeler Specialty: Nuclear Mechanic Dates of Service: Served 4/01 - 3/07 Decorations: 2 Naval Unit Commendations, Global war on terrorism service and expeditionary medals, National Defense Ribbon Tours of duty: USS Abraham Lincoln (CVN-72) 1/03 to 3/07 A friend of mine was on a ten month deployment ( I arrived in the middle) and it was a common practice to have certain members of the crew read the 'evening prayer'. I'm not a big fan of this activity, since there's no way to escape it unless you're asleep (They even stop the movies that are playing on the TV network and put up a splash screen saying 'Standby for the evening prayer'). My friend happened to be Wiccan. Her request was denied and she was told that not only was she not allowed to read the evening prayer (because only the Chaplain(s) were allowed to do so) but that her group could no longer meet in the chapel because the Xtians had to purify the sanctuary after every time the Wiccans met. It's a shame really, that those people are so closed minded.

I've been lucky and only had a few run ins with particularly religious persons, and not been discriminated against on a general basis. As for prayer in combat, whatever floats your boat.

As long as you're still paying attention! You can't glorify your god if you get killed with your head down, sniveling for protection. That's what your training was for. Navy Petty Officer 1st Class K.

Mark Northrup Specialty: Aviation Electronics Technician Dates of Service: June, 1983 - 30 Sept., 2003 Decorations: National Defense, Navy Unit Commendation, SW Asia Serv. Air Force Staff Sergeant Joe Suders Specialty: AMMO Dates of Service: as appropriate: Enlisted 4 Sep 00 Decorations:. AF Outstanding Unit Award - 1 oak leaf cluster, AF Good Conduct Medal, National Defense Service Medal, Global War on Terrorism Service Medal, Korean Defense Service Medal, AF Overseas Ribbon Short, AF Overseas Ribbon Long Tours of duty: 2000 - tech school - Shepherd AFB, 01-03 - Kadena AB, Japan, 03-04 - Hill AFB, UT, 04-05 - Kunsan AB, South Korea, 05- current - RAF Fairford, U.K.

Navy Reserve Lieutenant Rick Sarmento Specialty: Intel Dates of Service: as appropriate: March 1998 - present Tours of duty: Jan - Mar 2005, Balad, Iraq The level of religious influence in our government is truly frightening. This is not rhetoric, but fact supported by the latest polls that show atheists to be the least trusted group in society. As for religious practice in the military - I personally find its influence far too pervasive. I have regularly been 'preached at' by fellow service men trying to 'save' me.

Although I don't mind a good discussion, the simple fact that I don't believe makes me an outsider in my own unit -- to a certain degree. This nation needs to reawaken -- it needs another enlightenment by which people realize that rational thought, evidence and reason are the tools that lay the foundation of morality and happiness. Religions false promises and contradictory message have done enough harm -- it's time we abandon them. Army Private James Hughes Specialty: Air Defense Command and Control Dates of Service:: 20060228 I am still horrified at the amount of influence religion exerts over the Army of a secular republic. There is the Soldiers Code which says 'I will trust in my god.' There is the Pledge of Allegiance which says 'One Nation, Under God.'

There is the Army song which says 'faith in god, then we're right.' There is the fact that every ceremony I have attended was prefaced with a christian prayer including 'rites of passage' and 'graduation.' The drill sergeants at basic allowed soldiers to have bibles, but did not allow me to have a copy of 'Atlas Shrugged' by Ayn Rand, which represents my particular philosophy (Objectivism), but since it was 'only a philosophy' and not a religion, it was not allowed. At Fort Leonard Wood, MO we were required to go to the church building for a briefing by the Chaplain. We were required to go on a 'free day away' which was held at a church and ended in an evangelical salvation sermon. As an atheist who loves America and wants to fight for the freedoms that this country represents I am appalled at so blatant an establishment of religion, no particular religion, but religion as such, in our Army.

Army Reserve Sergeant Andrew Gotcher Specialty: Intelligence Analyst Dates of Service: as appropriate: 2004 - Present Tours of duty: OIF 03/06 to 03/07 Prayer should be 100% optional, and I have never seen an instance where someone was 'ordered' to pray in the military. All in all, the army is fairly indiscriminate in my experience.

I was told in Basic Training to go to services or I would have to hang around the barracks and clean all day. I found this very offensive at the time, and I cleaned with pleasure. But I realize now, that my Drill Sergeants were only trying to get out of having anyone to babysit. Army Colonel Bobby R Lang Specialty: military inteligence/infantry Dates of Service: Enlisted 1946, commissioned Army of the US 1947, commissioned Regular Army 1960, retired 1972 Decorations: Legion of Merit w/star, foreign citations Korea and Vietnam Tours of duty: Korea 1953-1954, Vietnam 1965-1966 Non-combat tours omitted Intelligence The religious nonsense used to brain wash persons from birth to death conditions them to look elsewhere for the responsibilities of life and to believe in an afterlife. Both sides in combat pray to the same nonentity, so neither should lose if there is an all powerful force guiding the outcome.

Might makes right according to clerics and politicians; why then did we lose in Korea, Vietnam, Somalia, and are fairing no better in Afghanistan and Iraq? Religiosity was stronger in some units than others. I was not discriminated against, I kept my convictions to myself. In the mess when asked to lead a prayer, I confined it to a plea for the deliverance and protection of women, children and the infirm without recourse to god. I was raised a southern baptist, in college I was astute enough to recognize the dichotomy religion/science and opted for science. Navy Petty Officer 2nd Class Jim Garn Specialty: SEAL Dates of Service: as appropriate: 1957 through 1966 Decorations: Primarily Vietnam related Tours of duty: USS Ault (destroyer), USS Bainbridge (first nuclear powered surface ship), USS Galant (Minesweeper), US Navy SEAL training I became an open or out of the closet Atheist during my combat tour in Vietnam, I used to debate with a Navy Chaplain that I was assigned to from time to time as his personal bodyguard. There is more to the story but I'm not ready to discuss it at this point.

Marine Sergeant Richard Dixon Specialty: avionics tech. Dates of Service: Jan 1995 - 3 Feb 2000 From Bootcamp where I had to listen to the sheep pray twice every night before lights out, and getting my balls broke for having NoReligiousPreference on my dog tags, I always wondered why there weren't more open minded Marines.

I have always taken freedom of religion to include freedom from it. I don't have a problem with services being made available to people in need, but it shouldn't be in my face, and when it's wearing the cloak of a millitary officer, there's a forced subserviance to their ideals. It's just wrong. I know that there are thousands of soldiers, sailors Marines and airmen that feel the religious pressure from the Bush on down as we fight Islam, I mean terrorism, which was it again? There are always positive stories as well, and there should be more posted on your site, our site.

Around the beginning of the 3rd month of bootcamp, one of our more aggressive drill instructors, nameless for the sake of what I hope is a rewarding career sent all the religious groups off to church. After all the other religious preferences had gone off to bow before their respective allmighties, the few, the proud, the Marines that were left in the squadbay actually got some time to hang out and relax. It was about 45 minutes, but there was no god in our midst, and it was a relief.

I would like to thank him, and I will if I ever run into him. Army Captain Gary Jones Specialty: armor crewman; judge advocate Dates of Service: Enlisted 28 August 1974 to 28 August 1978; Judge Advocate General's Corps, July 1988 - June 1995; Civilian employee April 1996 - Present Tours of duty: Grafenwoehr Germany 76-77; Neu Ulm, Germany, 88-90; Vilseck, Germany, 90-92; Sinop, Turkey 92-93; Vilseck, Germany 93-94; 1995; Vilseck, Germany 96-02; Bamberg, Germany November 2002 to Present. Our office Hail and Farewells, which are social occasions, were customarily opened with a prayer by a layperson.

Usually these prayers are made 'in the name of Jesus.' Objections are met with scornful looks. I attended a memorial service commemorating the terrorist attacks of 9/11. I was looking for some kind of closure but instead had to listen to Chaplains pray to their Christian gods and church music. This spoiled the ceremony for me because I do not believe in a god and because I know many Muslims praise 'Allah' for the great victory of 9/11. I can think of no greater 'blasphemy' than offering empty prayers to a lie to commemorate an event that is consecrated by the blood of innocent victims. I know of one company commander who requested that there be no prayers at his change of command ceremony but he was ordered to have a Chaplain lead a prayer.

My office overlooks the parade field where most of the change of command ceremonies take place. I hear the Chaplains turn these events into occasions to proselytize for their faith via their prayers. One is left with the impression that the Army has become a Christian Army. I do not go to church because I do not believe in any god.

I dislike being exposed to religious lies at secular government functions. If I wanted to listen to prayers and testimony, I would go to church. Army Reserve Specialist Randall Knapke Specialty: ordance/mechanic Dates of Service: /00-12-05 Decorations: 2 Army Acheviement Metal, 2 Joint Service Acheviement Medal, Global War on Terror Tours of duty: Guantanomo Bay, Cuba 05-03-06-04 I am a Global War on Terrorism Veteran. I just came across this organization. I which I knew more about this group when I was in the service because I never felt comfortable during events/prayers.

Also, I was never able to get agnostic on my dogtags which always disturbted me because if I died I didn't want to be mistaken for something I never was. Air Force Staff Sergeant Phil Smith Specialty: Nuclear missiles Dates of Service: 1987-1991/1992-1998 Decorations: Air Force Commendation Medal, Air Force Achievement Medal w/oak leaf cluster Tours of duty: Lackland AFB (1987), Chanute AFB (1987), Minot AFB (1988-1991), Desert Storm (1990-1991), Offutt AFB (1992-1998) I am an atheist, and never experienced any discrimination as a member of the military or as a civilian.

However, I am becoming increasingly alarmed by the movement away from our nation's secular foundations. Too many believe this is a nation founded on Christian principles, rather than principles discovered during the European Enlightenment. Prayer and other religious services should absolutely be provided to soldiers during peace and wartime.

I will never, ever, kneel before the supernatural; however, as a soldier and as an American citizen, the Constitution is the supreme word, not religious texts. I also support the notion that the Constitution can be scrapped if the people find it cannot serve their needs, so I do not see the supreme law of the land as sacred. Air Force Major Kenton Brown Specialty: Human Resources Intel Ops Officer Dates of Service: as appropriate: AUG 1969 - approx. SEP 95 (?) Tours of duty: Too many to name - CONUS, Germany, Panama, etc. I never had any anxiety or fear during para-ops. My confidence was not religion-based.

I just had great 'faith' in my equipment, the jumpmasters & riggers, and my peers. My safety depended on risk factors which I understood & accepted, yet mitigated by the competence of my comrades and my application of training & techniques. I never bowed my head during any religious rite or prayer, nor have I on the rare occasions that the Pledge of Allegiance was recited said '.under god.' While I never proclaimed my atheism, I never denied it either, just as I rarely discussed politics and remain a registered Independent. All of my ID/dog tags have been embossed either 'NONE' or 'NO PREFERENCE' where the religion info would normally be found. I don't put 'ATHEIST' there, since trying to pigeonhole atheism, 'no faith at all,' or 'superstitionless' as a religion is just a silly notion proposed by the religious.

It's tantamount to trying to measure zero. As a CO, OIC, or other leader, I would never have tolerated any such discrimination, if experienced by my peers or subordinates, any more than I would have tolerated racial or gender bias. I believe in the American dream and I fully support the Constitution's freedom of religion aspects, which clearly means freedom from religion, too. Air Force Staff Sergeant Carol Proctor Specialty: Personnel Admin Dates of Service: 16 Jun 93 to present/2 May 05 to present (civil service) Decorations: AFAM 2 oakleaf clusters Tours of duty: ctive Duty - Plattsburg AFB 16 Jun 03 to 17 Mar 05, Nellis AFB 17 Mar 05 to 28 Oct 00, Wright Patterson AFB 28 Oct 00 to 29 Nov 00 USAFR - Wright Patterson AFB 1 Jan 03 to Sep 3 05. USAFR at Peterson AFB 1 Oct 00 to present and Civil Service at the USAF Academy from 2 May 05 to present Specialty Health Service Management (4A051) 16 Jun 03 to 01 May 97 and Personnel Management (3S071) 02 May 97 to present I only had one discriminating experience as a nonbeliever that effected my career. It was at Wright Patt and I thought my supervisor accepted my beliefs as she was a 'good Christian'.

She never spoke negative and always listened to why I didn't believe and explained why she was a Christian and seemed sincere, but of course when my annual EPR was due, a month before it was due she became secretive and wouldn't let me see my OPR before she completed it and she in the process moved to another position. (I handled all EPR's/OPR's and decorations so it should have come across my desk). When you go from the last 3 years getting 'firewall 5's' and go down to a 4 it's a big let down. Plus she had the new commander sign it instead of the commander I worked under (she waited for him to PCS) and after she moved offices when she saw me she would avoid me at all costs - although I couldn't prove it I know in my heart it was because I wasn't Christian. I feel prayer in combat has it's place in the Chapels on base only, if someone wants a prayer at their retirement or promotion that should be allowed but not a Holiday Parties, in the office or at group promotions.

Religion should be private and not forced on anyone. My husband and I sponsor non-religious, atheists, agnostic and freethinking Cadets here at the USAF Academy so they can have a break from the military environment and be around other non-believers. Air Force Master Sergeant Paul Bailey Specialty: Intelligence Dates of Service: as appropriate: July 87 to Present Decorations: AF, Joint Service Achievement, AF Commendation (3), AF Meritorious Service Medal Tours of duty: Korea 89-90, 95-98, 01-02 I'm fighting my own little battle in the Air Force at the moment. Our higher headquarters commander mandated that everyone must wear an 'Airman's Badge', with a list of things that each of us is supposed to pledge. The badge includes the text, 'I pledge.to be spiritually ready.' I have taken issue with this line, as all references to 'spiritual' I can find invoke religion or the supernatural.

I refuse to make this 'pledge'. Army National Guard Private Evgeny Zolotarev Specialty: Infantry Dates of Service: May 2005 - current I'm about to get deployed in Kosovo. I went to some religious services during Basic.

I can't remember exactly what the chaplain told us about those who do not admit these ceremonies, but basically it was something like they are going to hell. Another thing, when I asked him about other religions - he said, why bother, if we KNOW that our faith is true. The other guys around me looked at me like as if I asked something so ridiculously stupid. I had doubts about Christianity at that time, but not anymore. I chose to live with no gods. I can't know for sure that there is no god.

I choose not to believe in god, as long as there is not enough evidence of his existence. Christianity gives no answers, but feeling of guilt. I realize now that it actually does spread hatred among people. Now that I studied Christianity a little, I just can't believe that there was time when I actually accepted it.

Air National Guard Tech Sergeant Kirk England Specialty: AGE Technician Dates of Service: as appropriate: 01 AUG 86 - Present Decorations: Commendation, Acheivement, NATO, War on Terror Tours of duty: RAF Bentwaters/Woodbridge Feb. '87 - Jun, '90, Ohio ANG '90-Jul '92, AZANG Jul '92 - Present I have volunteered for Iraq and Afganistan. I click my pen repeatedly and loudly during prayers at the start of meetings. The last time I had to do that was in 2002. I believe I was passed over for a promotion in 2000 because my supervisor at that time was a big-time Catholic and he knew I was a big-time Atheist. This is a quote from him, nothing religious, but see if it makes sense to you: 'Kirk you've got two college degrees, you've done all of your Professional Military Education In-Residence (very rare in the Guard) and you are currently teaching PME part-time at DM (Davis-Monthan AFB). So, for what it's worth, you have an unfair promotional advantage and it is my job to level the playing field.

Therefore, I am not going to select you to go before the State Promotion Board.' The two guys selected didn't do anything other than kiss his butt and show up to work, so maybe the butt-kissing had more to do with it. I never said to anybody at work how much of an idiot he seemed walking around all day on Ash Wednesdays with a cross smeared on his forehead. Army Captain Jay Williams Specialty: Personnel Dates of Service: as appropriate 1990-present Decorations: 4 Army Commendation Medals, 4 Army Achievement Medals, 2 Army Service Ribbons, NCO Professional Development Ribbon with numerical device (2), 2 Overseas Ribbons, 2 National Defense Service Medals, Humanitarian Service Medal, Global War on Terrorism Medal. Member of Audie Murphy and Sergeant Morals Clubs. As an atheist I accept death as a natural part of life.

Therefore, I have no irrational fears of dying that require the help of a supernatural being to soothe; this will not change in combat. I have found the military decidedly biased towards christianity and have suffered discrimination and been forced to endure religious experiences against my will. The army is primarily protestant christian and for all its lip service to equality and equal opportunity, it really only applies if you tow the line and act like a good christian.

Mounting a serious challenge to the religious majority would surely result in being severely ostracized and very likely end your career. Contrary to their claims, military religionists are no more tolerant of opposing view points than religionists elsewhere. Civil Air Patrol Major Timothy Smith Specialty: Air Search and Rescue Dates of Service: As Cadet Nov 1995-Feb 2001, As Officer Feb 2001-Current Decorations: Loening Award Medal, NCC Medal (earned as cadet), Red Service Medal (2 clasps), Mitchell Award, CAC Ribbon, Encampment Medal (1 clasp), Leadership Medal, Senior-level Search&Rescue Ground Team Badge, others. Tours of duty: Cadet 1995-2001, Aerospace Education Officer 2001-2002, Unit Historian 2001-2004, DDR Officer 2002-2003, Leadership Officer 2003-current. OIC for multiple activities including NCO Academy and Drill Teams.

As a member of the Auxiliary, I train cadets and participate in Search&Rescue. In my duties, not once have I sought the assistance of any power beyond that of myself and my staff. I do get quite upset however when event coordinators or activity commanders ask 'which' sunday service I will be attending, rather than 'if'.